"firearm handed to Alec Baldwin on Thursday was declared a 'cold gun,' meaning it was declared unloaded"

[Ricordo]

If not for Democrat Privilege:

"In the context of involuntary manslaughter, New Mexico Statute § 30-2-3 reads in its relevant part:

Manslaughter is the unlawful killing of a human being without malice. … B. Involuntary manslaughter consists of manslaughter committed in the … commission of a lawful act that might produce death … without due caution and circumspection.

*   *   *

Here’s how New Mexico's jury instruction 14-231 on involuntary manslaughter would be read to the jury if the blanks were filled in with relevant facts from Baldwin’s shooting of Ms. Hutchins [that content placed within brackets]:

For you to find the defendant guilty of involuntary manslaughter, the state must prove to your satisfaction beyond a reasonable doubt each of the following elements of the crime:

[Alec Baldwin] [pointed a loaded firearm at Ms. Hutchins and depressed the trigger, firing a bullet into her] ;

[Alec Baldwin] should have known of the danger involved by [Alec Baldwin’s] actions;

[Alec Baldwin] acted with a willful disregard for the safety of others;

[Alec Baldwin’s] act caused the death of [Ms. Hutchins];

This happened in New Mexico on or about the 21st day of October, 2021." https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/10/legal-analysis-alec-baldwin-situation-beginning-to-look-a-lot-like-manslaughter/

 

I can't remember the last time that a progressive Democrat pursued a criminal prosecution against a prominent Democrat. 

[gwalchmai]

Why was a real firearm capable of firing real rounds being used for this scene? 

[Historian]

42 minutes ago, gwalchmai said:

Why was a real firearm capable of firing real rounds being used for this scene? 

There are too many great replicas that are not going to fire a real round...that could have been used.

 

[Ricordo]

56 minutes ago, Ricordo said:

If not for Democrat Privilege

And THAT'S why they are talking about "complacency" on the set.

[janice6]

9 hours ago, Ricordo said:

Btw. There is eyewitness testimony that Baldwin, in other scenes, had safety-checked the gun he was handling.

I carry a gun all the time.  I am told that danger only has to happen once.  Prior history means nothing.  Every instance is here and now, only!

[Ricordo]

10 hours ago, Historian said:

So.  Having been on a team/squad/unit or two...over the years.

When you get tired.  When you get distracted.  That's when safety is over looked.    Human issues are exposed more.

 

Certainly. Thing is, it shows he is not entirely ignorant of what needed to be done. It's a different legal standard to be applied to a person, especially as to liability.

[Historian]

Just now, Ricordo said:

Certainly. Thing is, it shows he is not entirely ignorant of what needed to be done. It's a different legal standard to be applied to a person, especially as to liability.

Right.  I don't think he was totally ignorant and innocent.   Screwed, yes.  But ultimately he's the man in charge.

As a friend of mine once said, "It does not take a PHD to load a revolver."

 

[Huaco Kid]

"Cold" guns could be handed to many actors, on a set, at once.

I believe that it's against union rules for any of those actors to start fiddling with / opening / checking / closing / cocking / racking their firearm.  Full stop.

The legalities of this event will be a finger-pointing-circle for years.

[Ricordo]

8 hours ago, janice6 said:

I carry a gun all the time.  I am told that danger only has to happen once.  Prior history means nothing.  Every instance is here and now, only!

I understand. But the standard for involuntary manslaughter in New Mexico is "without due caution". That's why the authorities are talking about "complacency" regarding gun safety on the set. 

You can be complacent, but not reach the point of "without due caution". Even if he Baldwin knew how to safety-check. He just "missed it".

The authorities have found their theory. When that happens, you only have to find the evidence to support your conclusion. Prosecutorial discretion. Seen it a lot of times.

And so it goes...

[Ricordo]

15 minutes ago, Historian said:

Right.  I don't think he was totally ignorant and innocent.   Screwed, yes.  But ultimately he's the man in charge.

As a friend of mine once said, "It does not take a PHD to load a revolver."

 

Yes Sir. But some people don't know how to do that. And a different legal standard applies to them. Not the same driving without a license than never driven a car before.

However, at this point, I believe it's all moot. The authorities have found their theory of the case.

[Ricordo]

13 minutes ago, Huaco Kid said:

"Cold" guns could be handed to many actors, on a set, at once.

I believe that it's against union rules for any of those actors to start fiddling with / opening / checking / closing / cocking / racking their firearm.  Full stop.

The legalities of this event will be a finger-pointing-circle for years.

Yes. The industry-wide protocol is rather specific.

From the reports of the incident, I wanted to see how many on that set missed. It's as if they didn't know the protocol existed.

https://www.csatf.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/01FIREARMS.pdf 

[Ricordo]

Here's the fall guy...

 

 

And that's with eyewitness testimony that Baldwin, in other scenes, had safety-checked the gun he was handling.

[Ricordo]

41 minutes ago, Ricordo said:

Prosecutorial discretion.

Whenever you hear that, more often than not, think "You never really thought that I was going to charge a fellow ______________, did you?'.

It's, more often than not, double-speak.

It is what it is....

[Ricordo]

But, don't worry, be happy.

We have a new four-star trans admiral.

 

 

[willie-pete]

58 minutes ago, Ricordo said:

Yes. The industry-wide protocol is rather specific.

From the reports of the incident, I wanted to see how many on that set missed. It's as if they didn't know the protocol existed.

https://www.csatf.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/01FIREARMS.pdf 

If I was an actor, I would not accept a gun that was handed to me with the comment that it was a “ cold gun “. If I could not check it personally, someone would have to show me it was empty. Maybe that is why I am not an actor.

I have been an NRA Range Master for 20+ years and have RO’d thousand or matches and tens of thousands of shooters. Every time before a shooter has left the line they have had to show me the gun is empty.
 

I have also been on ranges at the time that 4 people have been shot. Luckily they all survived. All four people were shot because they forgot the rule

 

DON’T POINT THE GUN AT SOMETHING YOU DO NOT INTEND TO DESTROY.

 

 

AB pointed the gun at a group of people.

[DAKA]

WHY Did he have his finger on the trigger? WHY did he "pull" the trigger..........

Bottom line ALEC BALDWIN IS A POMPOUS ASSHAT...POINTING A GUN AT SOMEONE AND PULLING THE TRIGGER...

NEEDS TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE  

[Ricordo]

39 minutes ago, willie-pete said:

If I ...

pointed the gun at a group of people.

Kindly correct me if I'm wrong. You are supposed to learn the rules first and then the manual of arms of the particular firearm you are handling.

Some folks just breeze through the rules let alone the manual of arms.

In another forum, a well-intentioned gentleman asked what was meant by 8 +1 when referring to a magazine. I strongly encouraged him to take a gun safety course.

His reply?  He had years of experience handling AKs but not pistols. And a CC license.

What else could I do? You can lead a horse to water... 

[Ricordo]

17 minutes ago, DAKA said:

ALEC BALDWIN IS A P A...POINTING A GUN AT SOMEONE AND PULLING THE TRIGGER...

NEEDS TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE  

I wouldn't stop at P  A.

In 50 years of handling firearms I have never accidentally killed anyone. Knock on wood.

[DAKA]

36 minutes ago, Ricordo said:

I wouldn't stop at P  A.

In 50 years of handling firearms I have never accidentally killed anyone. Knock on wood.

99,99% of us have better sense than that A/H ....... Have you EVER POINTED A GUN AT ANYONE? NO LESS PULLED THE TRIGGER....

I have been shooting guns for over 70 YEARS and I have NEVER DONE THAT.   (Well,I do admit to pointing my "Finger Gun" at someone now and then)

[Historian]

6 minutes ago, DAKA said:

99,99% of us have better sense than that A/H ....... Have you EVER POINTED A GUN AT ANYONE? NO LESS PULLED THE TRIGGER....

 

Very few times.  And I will be honest.  I was scared to the point where I had to force myself to think.  It's been close.

There it is.  And I hope to finish my time in uniform without pulling the trigger outside of the range.

[Ricordo]

I'll say it again.

If someone hands you a firearm and tells you that it's unloaded, and you don't check it,  point that firearm at somebody and pull (press) the trigger and it fires and that somebody is killed...what do you think will happen to you?

I hope I'm wrong, but I think the die is cast. Baldwin walks.

[railfancwb]

Debunking one “theory”…

https://www.boomlive.in/world/halyna-hutchins-alec-baldwin-prop-gun-accidental-death-hollywood-pedophilia-documentary-fact-check-15325
 

[M&P15T]

On 10/26/2021 at 11:34 AM, Gunboat1 said:

A lifetime of firearms safety training and experience says that is completely incorrect.

Sigh.....

All I'm reading, over and over and over and over and over and over again in this thread, is the rules of gun safety weren't followed.

Your (and others here) lifetime of firearms safety training and experience means absolutely nothing on a film set. And until you firmly, mentally grasp that, you're lost in the discussion. And in fact your lifetime of firearms training and experience (and seething hatred for A.B.) are specifically stopping you from properly understanding what happened on that film set. Those rules specifically do not apply. At all. Not one bit. They simply do not exist.

If you need a graphic representation of this, watch any John Wick movie.

On film sets actors and actresses routinely point very real, very deadly weapons at each other, and repeatedly pull the trigger. They also point them directly at cameras and their operators, and deliberately and repeatedly pull the trigger. This is normal and standard practice, and shows that everything "gun people" think and follow about gun safety does not apply on a film set.

Also there seems to be confusion as the the word "prop", as in "prop gun". "Prop" does not mean fake. It means it's the "property" of the production company. Most "prop" guns are 100% real, genuine firearms, and the only difference is the ammunition used in them, which are blanks. For insight into this, you can reference the YT channel "Forgotten Weapons" hosted by Ian McCullum. He looks at many interesting firearms, owned by (and filmed at) companies that supply/provide weapons to movie and TV production companies, and the firearms are 100% real and functioning.

And once all of the above is completely and thoroughly understood and comprehended, it will dawn on most folks that the number of people accidently killed on film sets with firearms is remarkably low. Astonishingly low in fact. Which does go to show that on most sets, there are real (if different) safety protocols being followed.

[SC Tiger]

19 hours ago, Walt Longmire said:

Riiiiight. I accidently forgot to check the weapon, accidently pointed it at 2 people, and accidently pulled the trigger. Ignoring every gun handling rule ever made. Accidently.

Here's what you're missing - the scene likely called for him to point the weapon at the camera and pull the trigger.

Movies are a different world.  Plain and simple.  They require guns to be pointed at people, objects, animals - and the triggers pulled.  That's why there is a world of different safety checks. I have my questions about some of those methods but in the end, if Baldwin was following the rules as presented, he is in the clear.

That's why the safety checks are different and you are supposed to have an armorer who knows WTF he or she is doing.  

That said - it may not even be on the armorer.  If she prepped the guns and they were tampered with after the fact, it may not be on her.

 

So many here want to pin this on Baldwin because they don't like his politics.  Probably because he dislikes Trump.  And that just isn't fair to the man.  We are supposed to be better than that.

[M&P15T]

16 hours ago, gwalchmai said:

I've seen actors get shot in movies and TV. Not cinematographers or producers. Admittedly, some producers may need to be shot, but that's grist for another mill.

You're being deliberately obtuse. You've seen many, many scenes in movies and TV from a 1st person perspective where the gun is pointed directly at YOU the viewer. Any moron can understand that creating such a shot meant that the camera, camera operator, and in this case (since this was rehearsing the scene) the cinematographer had the gun pointed at them, and the trigger was pulled.