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What is the evolutionary advantage here?


gwalchmai
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Don't know. Maybe it's the knowledge or instinct to know when somebody needs help, no matter how stupid they seem because they made a mistake and got themselves flipped over on their back.

Wow!  Talk about a discussion starter!!😬😬😬😁😁😁😁😁😅😎

 

 

 

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Pretty sure tortoise's like them mate for life.  If it stays on it's back for very long at all, it will die.  I think it's just "instinct" for a turtle to flip another turtle when ever they see one flipped.  That was probably his or her mate.  So, needless to say...no more genes of that couple would be passed on....

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Of course we can't know if they're mated, so I'll assume they aren't and that the rescuer will rescue any tortoise. So at some point a tortoise was born who reacted to the "flail response" by flipping stranded tortoises. Then somehow this trait got passed on. How? What's the advantage of flipping stranded tortoises? i.e., how did that instinct develop? 

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34 minutes ago, inthefrey said:

Don't know. Maybe it's the knowledge or instinct to know when somebody needs help, no matter how stupid they seem because they made a mistake and got themselves flipped over on their back.

 

 

 

You think it's empathetic? The rescuer realizes the stranded tortoise needs help and gives it? Maybe.

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Most animals will aid a distressed kind if they can. I've seen deer try to "wake up" one that had been shot and fallen. Wolves care for their wounded and sick by bringing food and water and comforting the victims. Dogs will comfort each other and even their human.

Not an out of concept idea.

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6 minutes ago, inthefrey said:

Maybe. Probably just a natural instinct. I hear tortoises live longer than human beings do. 

Right. I'm trying to get a feel for how that "instinct" develops over generations. Since it's not learned behavior I'm going to assume it's hereditary (there's no other mechanism), so there's probably an evolutionary advantage. 

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1 hour ago, gwalchmai said:

Of course we can't know if they're mated, so I'll assume they aren't and that the rescuer will rescue any

. So at some point a tortoise was born who reacted to the "flail response" by flipping stranded tortoises. Then somehow this trait got passed on. How? What's the advantage of flipping stranded tortoises? i.e., how did that instinct develop? 

By implying feelings we screw up evolution to begin with.

Survival of the fittest is just that. The day we started rejecting it, we started our own devolution. But hey, at least "unprivileged" people feel equal now.

Stupid people like Democrats trying to make us all equal, and ruining it for us all.

In reality, male tortoise flip their male opponents over to gain access to a female. THAT is evolution.

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2 hours ago, gwalchmai said:

Right. I'm trying to get a feel for how that "instinct" develops over generations. Since it's not learned behavior I'm going to assume it's hereditary (there's no other mechanism), so there's probably an evolutionary advantage. 

What else are instincts, but learned behavior passed on over a long timeline? 

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2 hours ago, gwalchmai said:

Right. I'm trying to get a feel for how that "instinct" develops over generations. Since it's not learned behavior I'm going to assume it's hereditary (there's no other mechanism), so there's probably an evolutionary advantage. 

Ingrained in the DNA. The survival of species is so primal, it has "always" existed.

Even as corrupt as people are, given to their own demise without outside influence, we are pretty decent to one another, no matter skin color, hair color, or what ever. Everything is learned or taught. Either by influence or reaction. Even being the cynical little party favor that I have become. 😆

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4 hours ago, Eric said:

What else are instincts, but learned behavior passed on over a long timeline? 

Good question. Learned behavior can't be passed on. The DNA in your gametes are blueprinted at your birth. Females are born with their entire complement of eggs. 

What can be passed on are genetic predispositions. So if I'm born with a mutation that predisposes me to flipping tortoises which I find stranded on their back in a desert, my boys will have that mutation and it can be passed on. I may be able to pass on a knack for learning languages, but not any fluency in French I may have learned. 

OK, that makes sense, but does that mean seasonal migratory behavior is programmed into genes? Probably, since salmon aren't taught by their parents to go back to their spawning grounds. Put another way, those salmon whose behavioral expression of their genetic makeup leads them back to the their spawning grounds get to mate and pass on those genes. Mutations which take them to the WalMart die off. 

Wish I'd stayed awake more in class...

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