gwalchmai Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 How does flipping another tortoise increase the chance of your genes being passed on? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthefrey Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 Don't know. Maybe it's the knowledge or instinct to know when somebody needs help, no matter how stupid they seem because they made a mistake and got themselves flipped over on their back. Wow! Talk about a discussion starter!!😬😬😬😁😁😁😁😁😅😎 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swampfox762 Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 Pretty sure tortoise's like them mate for life. If it stays on it's back for very long at all, it will die. I think it's just "instinct" for a turtle to flip another turtle when ever they see one flipped. That was probably his or her mate. So, needless to say...no more genes of that couple would be passed on.... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwalchmai Posted August 8, 2021 Author Share Posted August 8, 2021 Of course we can't know if they're mated, so I'll assume they aren't and that the rescuer will rescue any tortoise. So at some point a tortoise was born who reacted to the "flail response" by flipping stranded tortoises. Then somehow this trait got passed on. How? What's the advantage of flipping stranded tortoises? i.e., how did that instinct develop? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwalchmai Posted August 8, 2021 Author Share Posted August 8, 2021 34 minutes ago, inthefrey said: Don't know. Maybe it's the knowledge or instinct to know when somebody needs help, no matter how stupid they seem because they made a mistake and got themselves flipped over on their back. You think it's empathetic? The rescuer realizes the stranded tortoise needs help and gives it? Maybe. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostinTexas Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 Most animals will aid a distressed kind if they can. I've seen deer try to "wake up" one that had been shot and fallen. Wolves care for their wounded and sick by bringing food and water and comforting the victims. Dogs will comfort each other and even their human. Not an out of concept idea. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inthefrey Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, gwalchmai said: You think it's empathetic? The rescuer realizes the stranded tortoise needs help and gives it? Maybe. Maybe. Probably just a natural instinct. I hear tortoises live longer than human beings do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwalchmai Posted August 8, 2021 Author Share Posted August 8, 2021 6 minutes ago, inthefrey said: Maybe. Probably just a natural instinct. I hear tortoises live longer than human beings do. Right. I'm trying to get a feel for how that "instinct" develops over generations. Since it's not learned behavior I'm going to assume it's hereditary (there's no other mechanism), so there's probably an evolutionary advantage. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crockett Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 1 hour ago, gwalchmai said: Of course we can't know if they're mated, so I'll assume they aren't and that the rescuer will rescue any . So at some point a tortoise was born who reacted to the "flail response" by flipping stranded tortoises. Then somehow this trait got passed on. How? What's the advantage of flipping stranded tortoises? i.e., how did that instinct develop? By implying feelings we screw up evolution to begin with. Survival of the fittest is just that. The day we started rejecting it, we started our own devolution. But hey, at least "unprivileged" people feel equal now. Stupid people like Democrats trying to make us all equal, and ruining it for us all. In reality, male tortoise flip their male opponents over to gain access to a female. THAT is evolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuteTheMall Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 Because teamwork and mutual defense protects the species. Also, to get laid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minervadoe Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 It's the do unto others as you would have done to you gene. Species without it don't survive long. Besides, isn't turtle tipping a thing like cow tipping? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Eric Posted August 8, 2021 Administrators Share Posted August 8, 2021 2 hours ago, gwalchmai said: Right. I'm trying to get a feel for how that "instinct" develops over generations. Since it's not learned behavior I'm going to assume it's hereditary (there's no other mechanism), so there's probably an evolutionary advantage. What else are instincts, but learned behavior passed on over a long timeline? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostinTexas Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 2 hours ago, gwalchmai said: Right. I'm trying to get a feel for how that "instinct" develops over generations. Since it's not learned behavior I'm going to assume it's hereditary (there's no other mechanism), so there's probably an evolutionary advantage. Ingrained in the DNA. The survival of species is so primal, it has "always" existed. Even as corrupt as people are, given to their own demise without outside influence, we are pretty decent to one another, no matter skin color, hair color, or what ever. Everything is learned or taught. Either by influence or reaction. Even being the cynical little party favor that I have become. 😆 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crockett Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 Our Florida turtles won't flip you over, they will flip you off with your own finger! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwalchmai Posted August 8, 2021 Author Share Posted August 8, 2021 4 hours ago, Eric said: What else are instincts, but learned behavior passed on over a long timeline? Good question. Learned behavior can't be passed on. The DNA in your gametes are blueprinted at your birth. Females are born with their entire complement of eggs. What can be passed on are genetic predispositions. So if I'm born with a mutation that predisposes me to flipping tortoises which I find stranded on their back in a desert, my boys will have that mutation and it can be passed on. I may be able to pass on a knack for learning languages, but not any fluency in French I may have learned. OK, that makes sense, but does that mean seasonal migratory behavior is programmed into genes? Probably, since salmon aren't taught by their parents to go back to their spawning grounds. Put another way, those salmon whose behavioral expression of their genetic makeup leads them back to the their spawning grounds get to mate and pass on those genes. Mutations which take them to the WalMart die off. Wish I'd stayed awake more in class... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwalchmai Posted August 8, 2021 Author Share Posted August 8, 2021 4 hours ago, crockett said: Our Florida turtles won't flip you over, they will flip you off with your own finger! That's why you don't go skinny-dipping in Florida lakes. The dangly bits are attractive lures... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crockett Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 9 minutes ago, gwalchmai said: That's why you don't go skinny-dipping in Florida lakes. The dangly bits are attractive lures... I know. I have those mean ******* in my backyard lake. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holyjohnson Posted August 8, 2021 Share Posted August 8, 2021 aren't we assuming the Hero Tortoise wasn't the jerk who tipped him over to begin with.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWARREN123 Posted August 9, 2021 Share Posted August 9, 2021 Maybe one is female and the other is male. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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