First real female Green Beret

[Fnfalman]

3 hours ago, Gunboat1 said:

I work on a daily basis with about a dozen Special Forces veterans, with experience from Vietnam to Afghanistan and a lot of places no one has ever heard of.  Many are former Q Course instructors.   And they, to a man, know and attest that putting females into combat units is a bad idea.   Putting a green beret on a female in the interest of PC is counterproductive and inherently useless.   They see this as a huge mistake.  That's what I have.

You, on the other hand, have only obtuse obstinacy and a losing, false argument.   I'll stick with the SF veterans.

So, just to be clear:  you never had any type of special forces or operations training, nor you had any military experience that is of special operations nature. 
 

oh yeah, I hung out and got drunk with 5th Group boys at Ft. Campbell and 7th Group boys at Ft. Bragg too.   It doesn’t make me a special ops expert. Your dealings with the snake eaters also don’t make you an expert either. 

so, until you show me a Ranger School tab or an SF tab, your opinion of these hard core women are totally worthless  

BTW, you don’t get to pass the Q Course without passing peer review. If this chick were to fully pass the Q Course, ergo she passed both her peer reviews and instructors reviews.  You know, those pesky Green Berets types. 

Edited June 21, 2020 by Fnfalman

[Gunboat1]

Fortunately,  the validity of my assertions regarding the stupidity of assigning women to combatant units, the lowering of standards which has been done to facilitate female "successes" in training, and the overall deleterious effects of pursuing these PC policies on combat capabilities, doesn't depend on your approval.  I couldn't care less what you think or say about them.  And you apparently couldn't be clear about anything of import if your life depended upon it.

Typical of your usual evasions, you conflate  "hanging out and getting drunk" with SF types with holding serious discussions with decorated combat veterans. repeatedly,  over time, on this topic.  You ignore their stated informed opinions because they refute your specious argument,  and instead propose that your (assumed) positive peer evaluations made under the duress of an Army establishment that has decreed that women will be helped to "succeed" trump those sound, reasoned and qualified opinions.  

Your strawman construction/destruction skills are weak.  Your logic is contorted. But you are persistent in your evasion, obstinacy and obtuseness. That has to be admitted.?

Edited June 21, 2020 by Gunboat1

[Wyzz Kydd]

7 hours ago, Fnfalman said:

So, just to be clear:  you never had any type of special forces or operations training, nor you had any military experience that is of special operations nature. 
 

oh yeah, I hung out and got drunk with 5th Group boys at Ft. Campbell and 7th Group boys at Ft. Bragg too.   It doesn’t make me a special ops expert. Your dealings with the snake eaters also don’t make you an expert either. 

so, until you show me a Ranger School tab or an SF tab, your opinion of these hard core women are totally worthless  

BTW, you don’t get to pass the Q Course without passing peer review. If this chick were to fully pass the Q Course, ergo she passed both her peer reviews and instructors reviews.  You know, those pesky Green Berets types. 

I’ve never played football in the NFL, but I knew Jamies crab legs Winston would be a bust. Never flown in a spacecraft but knew that dude out west building his own rocket wasn’t going to survive. Never drove a Yugo, but took a quick look and read the specs and knew it was garbage.

Your premise that without SF experience an opinion is ‘totally worthless’ is demonstrably false.

We have thousands of years of empirical data on the effect including woman in combat troops has. 

The Marine Corps experimented with the concept about 5 years ago and determined that woman are twice as likely to suffer significant injuries, have significantly lower accuracy, and have poorer performance on basic tasks like avoiding obstacles and removing wounded from the battlefield.

I have shot with and competed against some of the best female shooters in SASS, multiple time World Champion shooters and regularly beat them. I am definitely not a WC shooter, when compared to other men, State Champ, sure, even South Eastern Regional Champ, but not World. There has never been a woman in the top ten at one of our World Championships, not in over 40 years. Rarely does one crack the top twenty and some of these women are professional sponsored shooters for Glock, Taurus etc. competing against amateur male shooters, and losing.

 

Edited June 21, 2020 by Wyzz Kydd

[Fnfalman]

6 hours ago, Wyzz Kydd said:

I’ve never played football in the NFL, but I knew Jamies crab legs Winston would be a bust. Never flown in a spacecraft but knew that dude out west building his own rocket wasn’t going to survive. Never drove a Yugo, but took a quick look and read the specs and knew it was garbage.

Your premise that without SF experience an opinion is ‘totally worthless’ is demonstrably false.

We have thousands of years of empirical data on the effect including woman in combat troops has. 

The Marine Corps experimented with the concept about 5 years ago and determined that woman are twice as likely to suffer significant injuries, have significantly lower accuracy, and have poorer performance on basic tasks like avoiding obstacles and removing wounded from the battlefield.

I have shot with and competed against some of the best female shooters in SASS, multiple time World Champion shooters and regularly beat them. I am definitely not a WC shooter, when compared to other men, State Champ, sure, even South Eastern Regional Champ, but not World. There has never been a woman in the top ten at one of our World Championships, not in over 40 years. Rarely does one crack the top twenty and some of these women are professional sponsored shooters for Glock, Taurus etc. competing against amateur male shooters, and losing.

 

Apparently those who are expert at military trainings and operations disagreed with you. 
 

 

[Wyzz Kydd]

31 minutes ago, Fnfalman said:

Apparently those who are expert at military trainings and operations disagreed with you. 
 

 

Yep, those Flag officers are really in touch with what is going on out at the tip of the spear.  That's why 'Military Intelligence' is viewed as an oxymoron.  Bunch of pencil pushing REMFs. 

[26isbest]

On 6/19/2020 at 6:37 PM, Fnfalman said:

The few good things that the Frenchies ever did in the world other than Roquefort cheese and Bordeaux. 

Delaying the Germans at Bir Hakeim in 1942 and taking the fight to AQIM these last several years come to mind.

[Fnfalman]

6 hours ago, Wyzz Kydd said:

Yep, those Flag officers are really in touch with what is going on out at the tip of the spear.  That's why 'Military Intelligence' is viewed as an oxymoron.  Bunch of pencil pushing REMFs. 

Yeah, instructors at JFK School are all generals and colonels...

 

PS. Tell us again your experience in the special operations works, especially the Green Berets since that this chick is about to become one. 

Edited June 22, 2020 by Fnfalman

[Historian]

3 hours ago, 26isbest said:

Delaying the Germans at Bir Hakeim in 1942 and taking the fight to AQIM these last several years come to mind.

The French did a nice job bottling up the English in two wars for us.   They also had a long-time commitment in Afghanistan.   Were part of the first Gulf War as well.  They also deployed to Bosnia.   But really have been doing a lot in Afria lately.

[Historian]

https://www.wearethemighty.com/this-classified-american-special-ops-unit-has-been-recruiting-females-for-decades

With the Pentagon making strides to include women in combat arms roles, you might actually be surprised to hear that the Army's top counterterrorism force has included female operatives for nearly 30 years.

https://popularmilitary.com/female-soldier-who-was-attached-to-delta-force-were-not-trying-to-prove-this-feminist-point/

A former female soldier who embedded with units such as the 75th Ranger Regiment and Delta Force is coming out about the exploits of her fellow female contemporaries in an effort to honor her fallen comrade.

------

It's all in how they apply the person to the purpose.   What is it you need done.

Edited June 22, 2020 by Historian

[NPTim]

On 6/19/2020 at 2:13 PM, Fnfalman said:

Ooooohhhh, can’t make a cogent reply. 
 

PS. here’s something that you can google on:  Cultural Support Team. It’s a brainchild of some liberal, hippy egghead dude named Eric Olson, a ladidah guy whose sole claim to famed are USSOCOM Commander and SEAL 6 Commander. Not any Joe of consequence that knows anything about warfare. 

Ouch, that stung. I did make a cogent reply, you not being able to grasp it is on you, not me. You simply can not admit that I am, at least partially correct. What the **** is a “laddish guy”? 

[Wyzz Kydd]

11 hours ago, Fnfalman said:

Yeah, instructors at JFK School are all generals and colonels...

 

PS. Tell us again your experience in the special operations works, especially the Green Berets since that this chick is about to become one. 

Well if experience in SFs is needed to opine, why are we hearing from you Rambo? By your own rules you should be quiet.

[Fnfalman]

12 hours ago, NPTim said:

Ouch, that stung. I did make a cogent reply, you not being able to grasp it is on you, not me. You simply can not admit that I am, at least partially correct. What the **** is a “laddish guy”? 

You asserted that female Green Berets wouldn't be able to make in-road into the patriarchy that is the modus operandi of the Arab/Moslem world.  I simply proved you wrong.  I don't know about a "laddish guy", didn't say anything about a "laddish guy".  That's all you.  

[Fnfalman]

2 hours ago, Wyzz Kydd said:

Well if experience in SFs is needed to opine, why are we hearing from you Rambo? By your own rules you should be quiet.

I thought you taught Rambo everything he knew?  

 

I simply spread the good news about the great progress GI Janes had made in the Modern American Military - you know, the one that had been kicking asses and taking names for the last 15-years.  I'm not relying on my lack of expertise in the SF world to make any point, but simply defer to the experts that run USSOCOM, JFK Warfare Center, instructors, etc.

Tell me again what are your real life experience in Special Operations?  Were you Ranger/SF/MARSOC/Raider/SEAL?  Or did you simply play on on Modern Warfare?

[Fnfalman]

13 hours ago, Historian said:

https://www.wearethemighty.com/this-classified-american-special-ops-unit-has-been-recruiting-females-for-decades

With the Pentagon making strides to include women in combat arms roles, you might actually be surprised to hear that the Army's top counterterrorism force has included female operatives for nearly 30 years.

https://popularmilitary.com/female-soldier-who-was-attached-to-delta-force-were-not-trying-to-prove-this-feminist-point/

A former female soldier who embedded with units such as the 75th Ranger Regiment and Delta Force is coming out about the exploits of her fellow female contemporaries in an effort to honor her fallen comrade.

------

It's all in how they apply the person to the purpose.   What is it you need done.

I find it very interesting that these so-called red blooded American men would laud the efforts of Soviet female snipers in WWII and grudgingly gave the thumbs up to Female VCs during the Vietnam War.  Yet somehow they think that GI Janes are a bunch of weaklings.  Heaven forbids that America; the nation which fields the greatest Armed Forces in the history of human warfare, simply can't train and condition its female service members to do anything other than support roles.

I find it even more laughable that the critics never seem to have any sort of exemplary military training or experience either.  If they were, they would be running the Armed Forces right now instead of whining on the intrawebz.

[Wyzz Kydd]

6 minutes ago, Fnfalman said:

I thought you taught Rambo everything he knew?  

 

I simply spread the good news about the great progress GI Janes had made in the Modern American Military - you know, the one that had been kicking asses and taking names for the last 15-years.  I'm not relying on my lack of expertise in the SF world to make any point, but simply defer to the experts that run USSOCOM, JFK Warfare Center, instructors, etc.

Tell me again what are your real life experience in Special Operations?  Were you Ranger/SF/MARSOC/Raider/SEAL?  Or did you simply play on on Modern Warfare?

I've already mentioned my military experience, more than once.  I got paid strictly from the neck up.  USS Von Steuben  SSBN 632 Blue. RM PO2 SS. Four and out.

[Fnfalman]

2 hours ago, Wyzz Kydd said:

I've already mentioned my military experience, more than once.  I got paid strictly from the neck up.  USS Von Steuben  SSBN 632 Blue. RM PO2 SS. Four and out.

I just want to have you show people who read this thread again that you had zero experience with special operations training and experience.  Again.

[Wyzz Kydd]

35 minutes ago, Fnfalman said:

I just want to have you show people who read this thread again that you had zero experience with special operations training and experience.  Again.

True.  Zero SF experience.  A lifetime's experience with female bodies and how they differ from male bodies.  Some fairly intense experience with working as a team under pressure, morale, depending upon your shipmates when your life is on the line.  Little stuff like that. 

 

Submarines should not have mixed sex crews in my opinion. There is zero demonstrable benefit and clear disadvantages.   

 

I believe that morale, and cohesiveness are pretty universal.  Human nature is human nature, whether you're a snake eater or a bubblehead.

[Silentpoet]

Still no answer on the hotness question.

[Historian]

3 hours ago, Silentpoet said:

Still no answer on the hotness question.

 Not sure it matters.   After she's had her way with you, she'll rip your head off, just like a praying mantis.

At least that's my guess.

[Wyzz Kydd]

3 hours ago, Historian said:

 Not sure it matters.   After she's had her way with you, she'll rip your head off, just like a praying mantis.

At least that's my guess.

You can only hope it’s your head she rips off.

[F14Scott]

Here's my analogous experience. I don't have a Ranger tab, but I do have gold wings and a little green ink in my log book.

I watched the political machine that demanded women be allowed in Navy combat jets completely steamroll the expert instructors who wanted to DQ my friend and pretty good but not great pilot Kara Hultgreen. Eventually, with lowered standards (lots of extra training flights and multiple extra chances) and the impossibility of anyone at the RAG saying "no," she "qualified" at the boat and was sent to the fleet, where she promptly killed herself in the day, Case 1 pattern, the easiest of them all. She should never have been there. It's a goddamn tragedy.

If you think this gal passed Green Beret school in a vaccum, you're naive, slow, obtuse, or all three.

P.S. It's all fun and games until she's captured, raped, and likely impregnated in front of her buddies. Or can't drag one of them to safety before he bleeds out. Or makes the whole team 10% slower because they are waiting on her.

Seriously, if women can't come anywhere near making it in football, how does anyone think they can handle ******* combat?

If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing, anyway.

[Gunboat1]

9 hours ago, F14Scott said:

Here's my analogous experience. I don't have a Ranger tab, but I do have gold wings and a little green ink in my log book.

I watched the political machine that demanded women be allowed in Navy combat jets completely steamroll the expert instructors who wanted to DQ my friend and pretty good but not great pilot Kara Hultgreen. Eventually, with lowered standards (lots of extra training flights and multiple extra chances) and the impossibility of anyone at the RAG saying "no," she "qualified" at the boat and was sent to the fleet, where she promptly killed herself in the day, Case 1 pattern, the easiest of them all. She should never have been there. It's a ******n tragedy.

If you think this gal passed Green Beret school in a vaccum, you're naive, slow, obtuse, or all three.

P.S. It's all fun and games until she's captured, raped, and likely impregnated in front of her buddies. Or can't drag one of them to safety before he bleeds out. Or makes the whole team 10% slower because they are waiting on her.

Seriously, if women can't come anywhere near making it in football, how does anyone think they can handle ****ing combat?

If it jams, force it; if it breaks, it needed replacing, anyway.
 

This is truth and wisdom.  Facts are stubborn things. 

I vote "all three", based on long exposure to the obtuse inanity.???

Edited June 23, 2020 by Gunboat1

[JW3]

On 6/20/2020 at 11:51 PM, Fnfalman said:

So, just to be clear:  you never had any type of special forces or operations training, nor you had any military experience that is of special operations nature. 
 

oh yeah, I hung out and got drunk with 5th Group boys at Ft. Campbell and 7th Group boys at Ft. Bragg too.   It doesn’t make me a special ops expert. Your dealings with the snake eaters also don’t make you an expert either. 

so, until you show me a Ranger School tab or an SF tab, your opinion of these hard core women are totally worthless  

BTW, you don’t get to pass the Q Course without passing peer review. If this chick were to fully pass the Q Course, ergo she passed both her peer reviews and instructors reviews.  You know, those pesky Green Berets types. 

Where's your Ranger tab or SF tab?

[JW3]

Look up Katy Wilder.

[Silentpoet]

22 hours ago, Wyzz Kydd said:

You can only hope it’s your head she rips off.

Which head?