PPC shooters

[Ottomatic]

I've been competing in PPC for over 16 years, but it seems that it's not the same anymore.  Numbers are dwindling quickly.  Thinking of hanging up my guns (selling).  

Any others here (active or past)?

[jmax]

I was when I was a LEO a long time ago. Enjoyed it very much but most agencies stopped support starting it's down ward trend. 

Edited August 9, 2018 by jmax

[Mr. Black]

I'm not sure what you mean by numbers are dwindling.   If anything I thought PCC was all the rage nowdays?    

 

Some people might say I'm not a real competitor because I only shoot PCC in club speed steel matches. But I say it's as popular as ever and getting more popular.     

 

I'm the gomer that's out there with a clunky Sub2k and the new Ruger PC Carbine.      I don't have an AR platform PCC and I don't know if I ever will.   Well, never say never.  

[BMyers]

10 hours ago, Mr. Black said:

I'm not sure what you mean by numbers are dwindling.   If anything I thought PCC was all the rage nowdays?    

 

Some people might say I'm not a real competitor because I only shoot PCC in club speed steel matches. But I say it's as popular as ever and getting more popular.     

 

I'm the gomer that's out there with a clunky Sub2k and the new Ruger PC Carbine.      I don't have an AR platform PCC and I don't know if I ever will.   Well, never say never.  

I think the OP was talking about PPC (Precision Pistol Competition). You are correct about the huge up swing in the PCC market and those shooting it. I think it is a nice thing, which has made a greater selection of PCCs and price to come down.

As far as PPC, most of those shooting it in this area are older gentlemen. It appears that most new shooters are going the path of IDPA or IPSEC style of shooting. 

[SoCalDep]

I shot some pseudo PPC back in the early 2000s after I was hired by my department, but they discontinued the annual match after a couple years.  Recently, I was tasked with running the PPC event for the World Police and Fire Games.  I had almost no experience and no knowledge of PPC rules and procedures, so it was a steep learning curve.  With all the experience doing the event I developed a respect for PPC and also saw some of the things that are making it fade from popularity. 

Positives:

1.  A strong emphasis on accuracy with time limitation out to 50yds. 

This is a dying art, and it truly requires skill.  I love it!  Unlike some of the other sports where there may be that occasional far target, the ability to maintain accuracy at that distance is required and a substantial portion of the overall score.  For those "not there yet", there is the stock service matches that only go to 25yds.  This is a great balance!

2.  Clear divisions for pistol types.

A stock service gun REALLY has to be stock.  The rules are pretty darn strict.  Open guns can go pretty wild, but must use iron sights, which keep the accuracy requirement (50yds and all) legit.   

 

Changes that could revive the sport:

1.  New target.

The B27 represents some antiquated and obsolete ideas for law enforcement.  For many, it reminds us of a time when training and qualification had little to do with realism.  A target requiring accuracy is necessary, but I think PPC should move away from the B27 and towards something like the GSSF-style tombstone target with scoring rings... or even something like a B27 repair center.  The aiming area isn't realistic, so having the silhouette isn't beneficial.  If the "realism" of a humanoid target is desired, then the aiming area should be changed to the upper chest and an entirely different scoring system should be used. 

2.  Acknowledge that times have changed.

PPC was developed during a time when revolvers ruled law enforcement.  That has changed, and if the sport wants to survive, it must understand that "law enforcement" doesn't have the shooting skill emphasis it once did.  Law Enforcement culture has changed, and while there are still plenty of LE shooters, they aren't the majority, and their numbers are dwindling... rapidly.  A shift toward the civilian sector is necessary, which brings up my next point.

3.  Gun divisions - carry divisions.

PPC needs to take a new look at the handgun divisions and bring the requirements up to date with current trends (both civilian and law enforcement).  Numerous agencies are embracing slide-mounted optics for duty pistols (for both SWAT and patrol), as are military and civilian shooters.  A "carry optics" type division would allow shooters who understand the accuracy advantages (especially at distance) that optics provide to really push their limits.  I don't think the traditional PPC revolver divisions should die, but they need to expand. 

Further, currently PPC doesn't do much to regulate reloads and holsters.  I think having divisions for law enforcement (duty holsters and mag pouches, etc.), competition, and concealed carry would make the skills used for the sport much more transferable to other shooting sports and defensive firearm use. 

4.  Make it a bit more realistic.

The 50yd stuff is great, but sitting, and support-hand barricade need updates.  For the sitting... I would recommend going to a required unsupported (ie: arms may not be touching any other part of the body) kneeling or sitting position.  For prone, the torso must be on the ground, but technique should be up to the shooter.  For support-hand barricade, it should be one-hand only (as there is really no other damn reason to put the gun in your left hand) with support of the barricade allowed.  I think it would be cool if there was also a requirement for strong-hand only at that distance as well, so I'd modify the last 6 rounds at 50yds to be strong-hand only supported.

I'm trying to remember some of the closer stages, but I'd probably look at doing some strong and support hand only stuff up closer too.  Really build the accuracy skills whether freestyle, or one-hand only. 

As for mag changes, they are on the clock, but I'd mandate concealment for those divisions, duty pouches for LE stuff, and then a more "open" or "competitive" division for those who want to push the accuracy limits. 

5.  Shorten some of the times.

I would seriously shorten some of the close times... Yes, tiny groups would be harder, but up close there is no reality to the current time limits at 7 yards.  At 50yds, I think the time limits are probably decent, especially with the current accuracy standard.  At close distances, it would also make the mandatory reloads on some of the courses of fire more important, and it would make the divisions more relevant. 

 

I do really like PPC and I think it is a great sport for those who really want to push their accuracy, especially at distance, all while being under time constraints.  If one looks at the other shooting sports (IDPA, USPSA/IPSC, etc.), they have adapted to the times.  PPC can live if it does the same. 

[DWARREN123]

PCC is very niche type of shooting. Most folks now days do the defensive type of shooting with carry type pistols plus PCC can get very expensive.

[ede]

I'd like to try it but as far as I know there's no place to shoot near me. I've got a 64 I've kicked around the idea of rebarreling and maybe adding a CMore or PCC rail. Been looking for ideas and photos.

[Moshe]

The closest I know is at Shooter's Station in Conroe, every year has had a Glock pistol competition.  If you show up on the day to plink, forget it.

[21 shooter]

I shot PPC many years (decades) ago.  It will definitely make you learn to shoot accurately.  I agree with SoCalDep’s recommendations.   I’ve seen the trend away from accuracy in LE and that’s not good.   My old agency is now teaching officers to shoot steel all the way back to 100 yards.  
 
It would be great to see PPC catch on again.  I would add I’d like to eliminate kneeling and prone thereby keeping me from having to standing up.  This should be replaced with a senior division or “couch potato” class.  ?