Chain Saw - straight cut

[SC Tiger]

I’ve been cutting up a tree I had cut down and have discovered that when cutting a larger piece, for some reason I always wind up cutting it at an angle. It’s like the saw is tracking sideways or something. 

Is this a technique thing or could it be a saw problem?  The saw is a 42cc Homelite. I’ve gotten it stuck a few times and may have tweaked the bar.  I don’t see any damage but that doesn’t mean it’s not a little warped I guess. 

Anyone got any ideas?

[Silentpoet]

I tend to do that with hand saws.  No experience with chain saws, but to me that suggests there might be some technique issues.

[Walt Longmire]

3 possible issues. Chain not sharpened the same on both side. Bar rails need filed. Bar is bent. Try turning the bar over. Look CLOSELY at the chain.

[Walt Longmire]

Or the chain is a smaller gauge than the groove in the bar. Bar is wore out. So I guess that is 5 things.

[Rinspeed]

I'd be willing to bet the chain is not sharpened evenly.

[SC Tiger]

This is what I am seeing:

 

The saw will also stall if I put too much pressure on it. I might just get a new chain. I noticed this issue is most prevalent when the entire width of the bar is in the wood (Cutting a log thicker than the bar width). 

 

The saw itself is doing a good job aside from this.  It's no professional logger's saw but for what I need it does fine. 

I bought it as a refurb so the bar may have been damaged by the previous owner.  Or the 7 times I've gotten it bound up so far.

Another question - bar oil - can I use motor oil as a substitute in a pinch?  I am using the actual bar and chain oil now but I'm going through a lot of it.

 

Edited August 15, 2018 by SC Tiger

[XSIV4S]

Do you use oil in it when cutting (Does the bar stay lubed?). It almost looks like the chain has room to move on the bar and choose its own direction (You press down-it goes slightly sideways). I would take the chain off and look at the bar for signs of wear or grooves.

1. Using lube?

2. Right size and brand chain for the bar?

3. Chain tight?

4. wear on bar?

[SC Tiger]

9 minutes ago, XSIV4S said:

Do you use oil in it when cutting (Does the bar stay lubed?). It almost looks like the chain has room to move on the bar and choose its own direction (You press down-it goes slightly sideways). I would take the chain off and look at the bar for signs of wear or grooves.

1. Using lube?

2. Right size and brand chain for the bar?

3. Chain tight?

4. wear on bar?

1) Yes

2) Should be - came with the saw

3) Pretty tight.  It does loosen a bit as it gets hot but it's pretty tight.  How tight should it be?  

4)  Will check.  May just replace the entire bar.  Or get another saw as I would like to have something in case this one gets stuck (again).  The tree I am cutting up is pretty darn big (Water oak that was actually 5 trees that grew together, about 50-60 feet high).

 

I'm pretty good with most things manly, but I don't know much about chain saws.

Edited August 15, 2018 by SC Tiger

[XSIV4S]

I buy and sell a lot of them and have used a few different brands. What I actually do for a chain saw is once a year I do all my trimming and cutting in one day. Home Depot rents Stihls at a reasonable price and they put on a new chain with every use. Good saw, new chain and since I know they are going to throw the chain away, I don't mind getting into the soil some when I am removing something low to the ground.

Tightening: When you pull the chain near the middle you should see about 3/4 of the drive link. Also, only tighten it with the chain cold (The chain stretches as it heats up).

[SC Tiger]

3 minutes ago, XSIV4S said:

I buy and sell a lot of them and have used a few different brands. What I actually do for a chain saw is once a year I do all my trimming and cutting in one day. Home Depot rents Stihls at a reasonable price and they put on a new chain with every use. Good saw, new chain and since I know they are going to throw the chain away, I don't mind getting into the soil some when I am removing something low to the ground.

Tightening: When you pull the chain near the middle you should see about 3/4 of the drive link. Also, only tighten it with the chain cold (The chain stretches as it heats up).

I tighten mine cold and only adjust it when hot if I have a problem (I've had the chain come off while cutting if it gets bound up).  Mine is about where you suggest but I will double check it tonight.  

I admit I abuse the hell out of this thing.  Partially through lack of knowledge and partially through a "brawn over brains" mentality I get sometimes.

 

What kind of work do you do where you buy and sell so many?  

[XSIV4S]

3 minutes ago, SC Tiger said:

I tighten mine cold and only adjust it when hot if I have a problem (I've had the chain come off while cutting if it gets bound up).  Mine is about where you suggest but I will double check it tonight.  

I admit I abuse the hell out of this thing.  Partially through lack of knowledge and partially through a "brawn over brains" mentality I get sometimes.

 

What kind of work do you do where you buy and sell so many?  

I buy a lot of tools and some medical equipment, primarily from State and Federal auctions. I end up with a lot of large lots and have to sift through to figure out what is good. Seventeen years of doing it as a side job and then a full time job has made me research just about every kind of tool at some point to figure out how to test and use it.

[jmohme]

That happened to me once.

I was trying to drop a tree and the chain saw just went wild!?

Seriously though, I agree that its probably a chain or bar issue.

Edited August 15, 2018 by jmohme

[Cougar_ml]

2 hours ago, SC Tiger said:

This is what I am seeing:

 

The saw will also stall if I put too much pressure on it. I might just get a new chain. I noticed this issue is most prevalent when the entire width of the bar is in the wood (Cutting a log thicker than the bar width). 

 

The saw itself is doing a good job aside from this.  It's no professional logger's saw but for what I need it does fine. 

I bought it as a refurb so the bar may have been damaged by the previous owner.  Or the 7 times I've gotten it bound up so far.

Another question - bar oil - can I use motor oil as a substitute in a pinch?  I am using the actual bar and chain oil now but I'm going through a lot of it.

 

bar oil has tack additives.  That just means that it is very sticky and will stay on the chain where you need it when the chain is moving at high speed, rather than flinging off of it at the bar nose.

It is NOT recommended to use any other type of oil for the chainsaw, as they will not stick to the chain properly and the chain will wear out faster, as will the bar.  The chain will get additional wear at the rivets, the drivers will get faster wear in the bar groove, and the drive sprocket will wear out faster.

 

[SC Tiger]

4 minutes ago, Cougar_ml said:

bar oil has tack additives.  That just means that it is very sticky and will stay on the chain where you need it when the chain is moving at high speed, rather than flinging off of it at the bar nose.

It is NOT recommended to use any other type of oil for the chainsaw, as they will not stick to the chain properly and the chain will wear out faster, as will the bar.  The chain will get additional wear at the rivets, the drivers will get faster wear in the bar groove, and the drive sprocket will wear out faster.

 

Gotcha.  Haven't actually TRIED using something else, was just wondering.  

Gotta get a couple of quarts of the stuff anyway.  Probably pick up a new chain and maybe bar for the saw as well.

[Cougar_ml]

2 hours ago, XSIV4S said:

Do you use oil in it when cutting (Does the bar stay lubed?). It almost looks like the chain has room to move on the bar and choose its own direction (You press down-it goes slightly sideways). I would take the chain off and look at the bar for signs of wear or grooves.

1. Using lube?

2. Right size and brand chain for the bar?

3. Chain tight?

4. wear on bar?

 

2 hours ago, SC Tiger said:

1) Yes

2) Should be - came with the saw

3) Pretty tight.  It does loosen a bit as it gets hot but it's pretty tight.  How tight should it be?  

4)  Will check.  May just replace the entire bar.  Or get another saw as I would like to have something in case this one gets stuck (again).  The tree I am cutting up is pretty darn big (Water oak that was actually 5 trees that grew together, about 50-60 feet high).

 

I'm pretty good with most things manly, but I don't know much about chain saws.

 

1) always use some type of bar oil, as it's designed to stick to the chain at high speeds.

2)Most likely the chain is correct for the bar, as most smaller saws use .050 gauge chains, and .325 and 3/8 chain don't really work on the other's bar/sprocket.

3)chain should be just barely snug against the bar, or maybe the slightest bit loose in the very center of the bar.  You should be able to pull it out a little bit (maybe 1/2 inch or so) at the middle of the bar, but it should pull itself back into the bar groove.  If it makes a snapping noise when you let go it's too tight.

4)If you replace the bar, replace the chain as well.  While you are at it, check condition of the drive sprocket.  If it looks like it has large wear marks from the chain (like the sprocket is being worn down a lot) then replace it as well.  Some sprockets are either part of the clutch drum, or require the clutch to be removed, and usually require a special tool.  If you are not familiar with the process it's best left to a professional shop.  Worn sprocket on a low usage saw is another indicator that the chain was being run too tightly.

 

It's not uncommon for chainsaw cuts to curve a little as you use it.  The weight on the saw is not even, which means it's always trying to push down on the engine side, causing a curve to the bar side of the saw. The bigger the saw the worse it does it.  I'm not a professional by any means, but I've cut my fair share of logs, and unless you're really careful there is almost always some type of curve to the cut.  (in my defense, the Stihl 044 is a very heavy saw to begin with)

 

[SC Tiger]

5 minutes ago, Cougar_ml said:

 

 

1) always use some type of bar oil, as it's designed to stick to the chain at high speeds.

2)Most likely the chain is correct for the bar, as most smaller saws use .050 gauge chains, and .325 and 3/8 chain don't really work on the other's bar/sprocket.

3)chain should be just barely snug against the bar, or maybe the slightest bit loose in the very center of the bar.  You should be able to pull it out a little bit (maybe 1/2 inch or so) at the middle of the bar, but it should pull itself back into the bar groove.  If it makes a snapping noise when you let go it's too tight.

4)If you replace the bar, replace the chain as well.  While you are at it, check condition of the drive sprocket.  If it looks like it has large wear marks from the chain (like the sprocket is being worn down a lot) then replace it as well.  Some sprockets are either part of the clutch drum, or require the clutch to be removed, and usually require a special tool.  If you are not familiar with the process it's best left to a professional shop.  Worn sprocket on a low usage saw is another indicator that the chain was being run too tightly.

 

It's not uncommon for chainsaw cuts to curve a little as you use it.  The weight on the saw is not even, which means it's always trying to push down on the engine side, causing a curve to the bar side of the saw. The bigger the saw the worse it does it.  I'm not a professional by any means, but I've cut my fair share of logs, and unless you're really careful there is almost always some type of curve to the cut.  (in my defense, the Stihl 044 is a very heavy saw to begin with)

 

If I see a ton of wear there I will probably just retire the saw to backup duty rather than fix it.  This saw is pretty good but it's not that expensive.

[Cougar_ml]

I will say that a 42cc homelite is very much under powered for what you are trying to accomplish.  Yes, it works eventually, but it takes a lot more time and effort that a larger saw would.  

Just take your time, and don't try to do it all at one time if you don't have to.  

 

How long have you been using it, and have you sharpened the chain or taken it in to a shop to be sharpened yet?  

Even if you sharpen it yourself (which borders on being a black art to do it properly) every few times you should still take it into a shop and have it done professionally to get everything evened up on their equipment, otherwise you can end up with one side of the chain taller than the other, which will cause the same issue as you are having.  The rakers (the bump just in front of the cutter) also have to be taken down a little as time goes on.  They help clear out the chips from the cut, but also act as a depth gauge for the cutter they are a part of.  Too high and you don't cut, too much and you cut too deep and bog everything down.

 

 

[Cougar_ml]

Just now, SC Tiger said:

If I see a ton of wear there I will probably just retire the saw to backup duty rather than fix it.  This saw is pretty good but it's not that expensive.

right, that was something else I was thinking.  Homelite isn't the quality brand it was back in the good old days.  It's been about 40 years since they made a quality saw, and the brand itself has been sold off probably a dozen or more times since then.

If you expect to use it a lot I've been happy with any of the commercial lines of saws from husqvarna and stihl.  

For smaller saws it's hard to beat Echo's warranty and build quality in a prosumer/commercial entry level saw.

[SC Tiger]

9 minutes ago, Cougar_ml said:

I will say that a 42cc homelite is very much under powered for what you are trying to accomplish.  Yes, it works eventually, but it takes a lot more time and effort that a larger saw would.  

Just take your time, and don't try to do it all at one time if you don't have to.  

 

How long have you been using it, and have you sharpened the chain or taken it in to a shop to be sharpened yet?  

Even if you sharpen it yourself (which borders on being a black art to do it properly) every few times you should still take it into a shop and have it done professionally to get everything evened up on their equipment, otherwise you can end up with one side of the chain taller than the other, which will cause the same issue as you are having.  The rakers (the bump just in front of the cutter) also have to be taken down a little as time goes on.  They help clear out the chips from the cut, but also act as a depth gauge for the cutter they are a part of.  Too high and you don't cut, too much and you cut too deep and bog everything down.

 

 

It's no professional saw.  Honestly it does well for a homeowner and I only plan to do this once so I doubt I invest in a new saw just for this job.

It cuts pretty well but I've plowed a little dirt with it (accidently) so I think a new bar and chain will probably make it work well enough.  There are sections where I will probably have to either borrow or rent a bigger saw, or just call a pro in.  But I want to get as much cleared out myself as I can to try to mitigate the costs.

Thanks for all of the advice BTW.

[Cougar_ml]

Just now, SC Tiger said:

It's no professional saw.  Honestly it does well for a homeowner and I only plan to do this once so I doubt I invest in a new saw just for this job.

It cuts pretty well but I've plowed a little dirt with it (accidently) so I think a new bar and chain will probably make it work well enough.  There are sections where I will probably have to either borrow or rent a bigger saw, or just call a pro in.  But I want to get as much cleared out myself as I can to try to mitigate the costs.

Thanks for all of the advice BTW.

no worries.

Once the chain has hit dirt it gets dulled up pretty quickly.  At that point it needs sharpened in order to cut correctly.  If it's not consistently throwing large chips then it needs sharpened, or all you are doing is adding extra wear to the bar, chain, sprocket, and your back.

I would start with a new chain, get the one you have sharpened, and go from there.  If it's still cutting badly then look at a bar.  Chain should be in the $15 range new, bar will be in the $30-$40 range.  Not sure what they charge for sharpening in your area, it's usually in the $10 range here, or find someone that can teach you how to do it with a round file.  Doing a touch up sharpen isn't that hard, but anything more than that the errors start compounding themselves.

[pipedreams]

1 hour ago, Cougar_ml said:

It's not uncommon for chainsaw cuts to curve a little as you use it.  The weight on the saw is not even, which means it's always trying to push down on the engine side, causing a curve to the bar side of the saw. The bigger the saw the worse it does it.  I'm not a professional by any means, but I've cut my fair share of logs, and unless you're really careful there is almost always some type of curve to the cut.  (in my defense, the Stihl 044 is a very heavy saw to begin with)

 

I have noticed that when I see my cut starting to curve it usually can be corrected by repositioning my hold on the saw.  As mentioned it will tend to pushed down on the engine side and you can counter act that by shifting your hold.  Once your bar into the wood you can only correct so much without binding.

I touch up my stihl blade with a small 12 volt sharpener when in the field.  The sharpener has an angle guide which helps get the correct angle.  The Stihl blades stay pretty sharp if you keep them out of the dirt unless your cutting really hard wood.

[nitesite]

 

[nitesite]

4 hours ago, Cougar_ml said:

For smaller saws it's hard to beat Echo's warranty and build quality in a prosumer/commercial entry level saw.

This is TRUTH.  Long warranty, most have magnesium instead of plastic cases, have Japanese carbs with easy access adjustments, Adjustable oilers, don't need pre-priming, and have sprockets that are easily replaced.

Edited August 15, 2018 by nitesite

[Diggy485]

Only one side of a chain cuts, thus causing an angled cut. 

Think of it like a chefs knife, double bevel, vs single bevel. 

Edited August 15, 2018 by Diggy485

[Peng]

I think it's all technique.  We all have one hand that is dominant and that side gets more pressure during a cut.  An experienced butcher can tell you from a cut of meat if the person was right or left handed.  So can medical examiners if Ducky is to be believed.  When you use a saw of any type you are not usually cutting directly on the centerline of your body downward, it is usually to one side or the other so the cut is angled.