Which One Do You Like

[Moshe]

The military has done away with the Berretta 92F.  But, recently for the commercial market they came out with the M9A3.  The SEALS dropped the Sig 226 for the Glock 19, but there is the Sig MK25 226 on the commercial market.  Out of the two, which one sparks the most interest?  They pretty much are the same cost.

[fastbolt]

Well, if I was ordered to choose between them as an issued duty weapon, I'd opt for the P226, although there's only about a .4" difference in length (Beretta longer), and the width and weight is pretty similar. Unless Beretta has revised their trigger over the 92FS Vertec, I'd give the 226 a slight advantage in the DA/SA model for hair-splitting and personal preference for trigger feel and recovery. Both are good enough for gov work, though.

However, I wouldn't spend my own money on either of them, but that's just me.

If you have a hankering for one or both? It's your money, so whatever floats your boat.

[minervadoe]

It's funny, but of the guns you mentioned, the only one that I'd consider would be the Glock 19, and its not even in the running. 

[Historian]

Sig,

I have a lot of time behind them.  They run wonderfully.  I think with the quality mentioned it's a personal choice.  SIG or Glock I'd be happy.

[Moshe]

17 hours ago, minervadoe said:

It's funny, but of the guns you mentioned, the only one that I'd consider would be the Glock 19, and its not even in the running. 

I would be surprised if most of us didn't have a Glock 19.  I do.  Heavily modified to my specs.  RMR, suppressor sights,  Johnny Glock competition trigger.  It is extremely accurate.  The question is a hypothetical.  FYI, I am carrying an equally modified Glock 21, with magazine extensions to make them 17 round magazines. 

Edited June 7, 2019 by Moshe

[Cougar_ml]

17 minutes ago, Moshe said:

I would be surprised if most of us didn't have a Glock 19.  I do.  Heavily modified to my specs.  RMR, suppressor sights,  Johnny Glock competition trigger.  It is extremely accurate.  The question is a hypothetical.  FYI, I am carrying an equally modified Glock 21, with magazine extensions to make them 17 round magazines. 

I don't have the Glock 19.  Surprised?

I wouldn't mind one, but it's not high on the list of guns to buy right now.  

 

Of the choices listed, none of which have I held and only lightly read up on, I'd probably go for the M9A3 just because I'm not a special ops operator show off (I'm still young enough for that to possibly be an issue).  Plus that would then be an excuse to buy the pistol caliber carbine that can use the same magazines.  

[Huski92]

Sig for me. I have both, but prefer the Sig.


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[minervadoe]

6 hours ago, Moshe said:

I would be surprised if most of us didn't have a Glock 19.  I do.  Heavily modified to my specs.  RMR, suppressor sights,  Johnny Glock competition trigger.  It is extremely accurate.  The question is a hypothetical.  FYI, I am carrying an equally modified Glock 21, with magazine extensions to make them 17 round magazines. 

Hypothetical!!  Well, why didn't you say so.  I've never owned a Sig or a Beretta.  I'd like to put 1,000 rounds down range with a Sig and see what I think.  The Beretta, not so much.  I hear they were prone to jamming in our forays in the sandbox.  But, then again, if it's good enough for Walker Texas Ranger, I suppose it's worth a hypothetical try. 

[fastbolt]

On 6/7/2019 at 9:10 AM, Moshe said:

I would be surprised if most of us didn't have a Glock 19.  I do.  Heavily modified to my specs.  RMR, suppressor sights,  Johnny Glock competition trigger.  It is extremely accurate.  The question is a hypothetical.  FYI, I am carrying an equally modified Glock 21, with magazine extensions to make them 17 round magazines. 

Okay, I'm one of the people who have never owned, nor desire to own, a G19. The grip shape and backstrap angle is too dissimilar to many of the other pistols I've come to prefer over the years. I've only owned G26/27's because their shortened grip wasn't long enough to have that odd belled hump present on the G19/17's.

For largish plastic (meaning 4" or longer barrels) I much prefer the M&P, followed by the 99 series, with the rest falling into a broad "also-ran second" category.

Don't get me wrong, as I certainly could carry a G19 if provided and required. It's a fine-for-its-purpose service and reliable weapon. Just not an optimal choice if left up to me. It just doesn't interest me to own and wasn't designed with my hands/wrist in mind.

Edited June 10, 2019 by fastbolt

[Moshe]

On ‎6‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 6:32 PM, fastbolt said:

Okay, I'm one of the people who have never owned, nor desire to own, a G19. The grip shape and backstrap angle is too dissimilar to many of the other pistols I've come to prefer over the years. I've only owned G26/27's because their shortened grip wasn't long enough to have that odd belled hump present on the G19/17's.

For largish plastic (meaning 4" or longer barrels) I much prefer the M&P, followed by the 99 series, with the rest falling into a broad "also-ran second" category.

Don't get me wrong, as I could certainly could carry a G19 if provided and required. It's a fine-for-its-purpose service and reliable weapon. Just not an optimal choice if left up to me. It just doesn't interest me to own and wasn't designed with my hands/wrist in mind.

Nothing wrong with that.  

[Moshe]

On ‎6‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 5:49 PM, minervadoe said:

Hypothetical!!  Well, why didn't you say so.  I've never owned a Sig or a Beretta.  I'd like to put 1,000 rounds down range with a Sig and see what I think.  The Beretta, not so much.  I hear they were prone to jamming in our forays in the sandbox.  But, then again, if it's good enough for Walker Texas Ranger, I suppose it's worth a hypothetical try. 

Actually, the M9A3 comes with 3 17 round magazines that are coated and slotted to resist sand.  Although, it did this, it was rejected by the military trials, for the cheaper polymer SIG M-17.  The Glock 19 was in the running, but it was rejected by everyone except the SEALS, because it is lighter than an all steel 226 9mm.  With the right coating less corrosion to Sea Water as well.  There is also in the striker mechanism of the Glock the ability to created a drain through to deal with water.  Also, the primary weapon for all the above is not a handgun.  

[windowasher]

I would go for the G19X.  Harder to conceal, but I REALLY like the 43X and am saving my pennies for the 19X.  I have owned the civilian M9 (92fs) for years.  It is too bulky and heavy for me for EDC

[blueiron]

Both the M9 and the Mark 26 pistols will remain in use by personnel for many years. The DoD is still acquiring M9A1 pistols on current contracts. Both are excellent pistols.

My complaint with the M9 is that the "F" model is both a slide mounted decocker and a manual safety, resulting in the potential to activate the safety during a "combat reload". This is remedied by the "G" model decocker pistol or adapting the "F" model to the "G" model. The pistol, if suppressed, does not need a Nielsen device [Recoil booster].

The original P-226 with the stamped steel slide and pinned in breech block is a bit lighter than the later milled slide, but the milled slide is a bit stronger and doesn't need roll pins replaced to retain the breech block every several thousand rounds. The P-226 was found to need "mud rails" [small dips in the slide to allow grime and dirt to fall away] to enhance reliability, but this induced cracking of the duralumin frame rails. The early American made pistol frames had more issues than the German models and that's why SiG imported frames and mated them with American slides until SiG could improve QC. If suppressed, it needs a Nielsen device.

I own both the civilian Beretta M9 model and the West German P-226 model with mud rails and I love both of them. The SiG is easier to run shooting drills through and has a slightly easier manual of arms due to the ergonomics. The Beretta pistol runs like the slide is on ball bearings and is boringly reliable. There are lots of GI magazines and parts available for the Beretta.

I'm not quite a fan of the new SiG P-series pistols. I don't care for the duck tails and all the other variants that Exeter has introduced. 

[Borg warner]

For a 9mm pistol the size and weight of a Beretta 92 of a Sig P226, I'd much rather have a CZ75 SA that could be carried cocked and locked. Othewise, a Sig P226 Single Action Only Elite would be my second choice.

 

[Moshe]

On ‎6‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 6:33 PM, windowasher said:

I would go for the G19X.  Harder to conceal, but I REALLY like the 43X and am saving my pennies for the 19X.  I have owned the civilian M9 (92fs) for years.  It is too bulky and heavy for me for EDC

I had one for awhile, but when I did, I didn't understand the hype that much.  Short barrel, long grip.  It was like a G-17 and a G-19 made a baby.  A flat out G-17 that way would have appealed more to me.  But, again, no wrong answers, just preferences.  I had a 92FS for a long time, until I sold it.  It was a tack driver with a straight 8 and after lobbing holes through holes, I got bored.  That, and I didn't like that I could only put Night Sights on rear but not the front sight.  The main appeal for M9A3 is the grip option, a threaded barrel, and being sand and dirt resistant.  Except for spring issues the 96D could take similar abuse and fire.  The long DA only pull with a PITA, but no matter the dirt you kicked up out in the brush, and no matter the rain, or the dirty Remington Ammo, it kept running like a top.  It was heavy, and nearly impossible to carry concealed off duty then without printing, but I did anyway.  This was before Texas considered a CCL law.  The Luby's incident changed all that, when an idiot with a G-19 went on a spree kill.

Edited June 11, 2019 by Moshe

[Borg warner]

4 hours ago, Moshe said:

I had one for awhile, but when I did, I didn't understand the hype that much.  Short barrel, long grip.  It was like a G-17 and a G-19 made a baby.  A flat out G-17 that way would have appealed more to me.  But, again, no wrong answers, just preferences.  I had a 92FS for a long time, until I sold it.  It was a tack driver with a straight 8 and after lobbing holes through holes, I got bored.  That, and I didn't like that I could only put Night Sights on rear but not the front sight.  The main appeal for M9A3 is the grip option, a threaded barrel, and being sand and dirt resistant.  Except for spring issues the 96D could take similar abuse and fire.  The long DA only pull with a PITA, but no matter the dirt you kicked up out in the brush, and no matter the rain, or the dirty Remington Ammo, it kept running like a top.  It was heavy, and nearly impossible to carry concealed off duty then without printing, but I did anyway.  This was before Texas considered a CCL law.  The Luby's incident changed all that, when an idiot with a G-19 went on a spree kill.

"I had one for awhile, but when I did, I didn't understand the hype that much.  Short barrel, long grip.  It was like a G-17 and a G-19 made a baby.  A flat out G-17 that way would have appealed more to me.  But, again, no wrong answers, just preferences."

I've always preferred the G19 to the G17 but I like the G19x even better as and OWB carry gun. for IWB carry the G19 is better. The first time I saw a G19x I liked the proportions but hated the Coyote Turd Yellow color. And when I got to shoot one I really liked the feel and the balance of the gun and could shoot it well, and if they had made the same gun in black I'd want one. The barrel is only a half inch shorter but it makes all the difference in the world as far as the way the gun feels and balances in your hands.

When they came out with the G45 and I liked that better but I don't care for the forward slide serrations. But as you say, no wrong answers, just individual preferences. I also liked that they did a way with that little tab on the front of the grip on the G19x but the great thing about both the G19x and G45 is no finger grooves and no half moon mag cut-out either.

 

 

Edited June 11, 2019 by Borg warner

[Moshe]

31 minutes ago, Borg warner said:

"I had one for awhile, but when I did, I didn't understand the hype that much.  Short barrel, long grip.  It was like a G-17 and a G-19 made a baby.  A flat out G-17 that way would have appealed more to me.  But, again, no wrong answers, just preferences."

I've always preferred the G19 to the G17 but I like the G19x even better as and OWB carry gun. for IWB carry the G19 is better. The first time I saw a G19x I liked the proportions but hated the Coyote Turd Yellow color. And when I got to shoot one I really liked the feel and the balance of the gun and could shoot it well, and if they had made the same gun in black I'd want one. The barrel is only a half inch shorter but it makes all the difference in the world as far as the way the gun feels and balances in your hands.

When they came out with the G45 and I liked that better but I don't care for the forward slide serrations. But as you say, no wrong answers, just individual preferences. I also liked that they did a way with that little tab on the front of the grip on the G19x but the great thing about both the G19x and G45 is no finger grooves and no half moon mag cut-out either.

 

 

I am an old dog that doesn't learn new tricks, I suppose.  I can't IWB, I OWB with a cover shirt.  I like being first on the OODA loop.  Don't get me wrong, I am okay with everyone's choices.  It is just something I never really did.

[Wyzz Kydd]

On 6/6/2019 at 10:14 AM, Moshe said:

The military has done away with the Berretta 92F.  But, recently for the commercial market they came out with the M9A3.  The SEALS dropped the Sig 226 for the Glock 19, but there is the Sig MK25 226 on the commercial market.  Out of the two, which one sparks the most interest?  They pretty much are the same cost.

Neither. I have no use for 9/40/357 self defense pistols and I loathe trigger safeties.

 

5 minutes ago, Moshe said:

I am an old dog that doesn't learn new tricks, I suppose.  I can't IWB, I OWB with a cover shirt.  I like being first on the OODA loop.  Don't get me wrong, I am okay with everyone's choices.  It is just something I never really did.

Yep, I'm an old dog that could learn new tricks but I'm not particularly interested in doing so.  The 1911 platform has worked for me dating back to before I joined the Navy in 1981.  I see no need to change.  If 9 rounds of .45 ACP can't get it done then give me a long gun.

[Borg warner]

1 hour ago, Moshe said:

I am an old dog that doesn't learn new tricks, I suppose.  I can't IWB, I OWB with a cover shirt.  I like being first on the OODA loop.  Don't get me wrong, I am okay with everyone's choices.  It is just something I never really did.

I still prefer the G45 to the G17 for OWB. I've never liked the G17 and it had nothing to do with mode of carry, either OWB or IWB. For that matter I actually prefer a single stack for IWB carry so even though I like my G23 I carry it OWB rather than IWB but carry a smaller gun IWB more often.

After years of carrying 1911's both 5 inch and Commander size, the first Glock I ever shot was one that was new in box (no holster) at a range when a friend of mine bought one and wanted me to show him how to operate it. I didn't like the gun, but a couple of year later I picked up a G19 at a gun show and liked it so much I bough t it. It was my first Glock. Soon after I bought a G20SF which I also carry OWB as a woods gun.

[Moshe]

1 hour ago, Wyzz Kydd said:

Neither. I have no use for 9/40/357 self defense pistols and I loathe trigger safeties.

 

Yep, I'm an old dog that could learn new tricks but I'm not particularly interested in doing so.  The 1911 platform has worked for me dating back to before I joined the Navy in 1981.  I see no need to change.  If 9 rounds of .45 ACP can't get it done then give me a long gun.

I understand.  The .45 ACP is one of my favorite self defense rounds.  I also like more is better, simply because the odds of a lone attacker in this current society is no longer a thing of the past.  I don't like to have to reload, even though I can do it by feel in a dynamic situation that involves more than one aggressor.  I actually like the 1911.  I own one.  I own a lot of .45 ACP platforms from FN, to HK, to Glock, to the Springfield.  I am not impressed with all things Springfield, but they did a good job on the MC loaded operator.

[Moshe]

1 minute ago, Borg warner said:

I still prefer the G45 to the G17 for OWB. I've never liked the G17 and it had nothing to do with mode of carry, either OWB or IWB. For that matter I actually prefer a single stack for IWB carry so even though I like my G23 I carry it OWB rather than IWB but carry a smaller gun IWB more often.

After years of carrying 1911's both 5 inch and Commander size, the first Glock I ever shot was one that was new in box (no holster) at a range when a friend of mine bought one and wanted me to show him how to operate it. I didn't like the gun, but a couple of year later I picked up a G19 at a gun show and liked it so much I bough t it. It was my first Glock. Soon after I bought a G20SF which I also carry OWB as a woods gun.

10mm is a good round.  I have 3 G20's and a 40 MOS.  Now that multiple manufacturers are coming out with a 10mm PCC, Kriss made a 33 round mag for the 10mm.  I think that would work well in a PCC Carbine.  With a decent optic you can hunt with that.

[TXUSMC]

I have never forgiven the .gov for adopting the Beretta over my beloved service issued 1911. That 1911A1 pistol first issued to me in 1975 was probably of WWII origin (they made so many they didn't have to make any more), and those pistols collectively put a helluva lot of our country's enemies in the ground... Germans (two wars), Italians, Japanese, North Koreans, Chinese, Viet Cong, North Vietnamese, and probably some more in the western hemisphere (Haiti, Nicaragua, Dominican Republic).   Go ahead... call me a hater... but American exceptionalism took a hit the day we had to give up our .45s for the Beretta.

[Moshe]

I don't think you are a hater.  I like the FDE Colt 1911 that the USMC had  a really nice Colt.  However, 1600 is a bit steep for the civilian version.  

[Armorydoc]

I have a P226 and a G3 Glock 19. There's my answer.

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[LostinTexas]

On 6/6/2019 at 9:14 AM, Moshe said:

The military has done away with the Berretta 92F.  But, recently for the commercial market they came out with the M9A3.  The SEALS dropped the Sig 226 for the Glock 19, but there is the Sig MK25 226 on the commercial market.  Out of the two, which one sparks the most interest?  They pretty much are the same cost.

The only fault I could find with the M9 was it was a 9. The MK25 in the early years had internal springs that would corrode away very quickly. I guess they fixed that since they have had such a long run. I've read lots of claims over the years about use by SF. I used to know a lot of these folks and standard issue is about all any claimed. Take it with a grain of salt.

I'd go with the Beretta. If you want to chance some sort of collectability for the future, the MK25.

I don't think either would outglock the G19, but can't for the life of me, understand the logic of going G19 over a G17 in a service capacity.. Love 'em or hate 'em, that seems to be the standard everyone wants to compare themselves to.

Edited September 27, 2019 by LostinTexas