7-11 robbery video: Not impressive stopping power.

[PNWguy]

This video has probably appeared on various gun forums around the net, but it's the first I've seen it.

First thought was that the security guard obviously needs some more firepower.  He shot both men at 5' with a revolver and they are both still able to function.  One is up and walking around.  Second, he is very lucky their guns were fake, or else he would have been shot as well.  Then him going behind the counter and getting so close to them was idiotic.  They could have easily grabbed his gun and shot him with it.

Commentators are calling the security guard a hero, but he acted so stupidly after he shot them...

 

 

[SevenSixtyTwo]

A success nonetheless. 

[Moshe]

I fail to see the problem.  He was a good shot, and did not hit the clerk.  He was a huge muscle bound guy.  Those were skinny little men, who he would have beat down like a stake.  He took them over with a strong presence, that let them know he was in control.  Had he been a sloppy fat guy, the story might have turned out with them trying to jump him.  Presence, and dress make a difference.  They have shown that a lot of targets for violence have been guys that look like a food blister and have a sloppy uniform.  A guy that has a strong presence, that isn't a tub of crap, wearing a neat uniform, not so much.

Edited December 6, 2018 by Moshe

[AerynSun2]

8 hours ago, PNWguy said:

 

First thought was that the security guard obviously needs some more firepower.  He shot both men at 5' with a revolver and they are both still able to function.  One is up and walking around.  Second, he is very lucky their guns were fake, or else he would have been shot as well.  Then him going behind the counter and getting so close to them was idiotic.  They could have easily grabbed his gun and shot him with it.

 

 

I hope you are never on a jury.  Talk about missing the facts!

What part of the body were they shot?

He jumped over AFTER he shot them and knew the guns were fake.

[ccm2361]

Looked like good shooting to me. One handed & nailed them both & they gave up immediately.

[PNWguy]

5 hours ago, AerynSun2 said:

I hope you are never on a jury.  Talk about missing the facts!

What part of the body were they shot?

He jumped over AFTER he shot them and knew the guns were fake.

Jury?  What the hell are you talking about?  I never said or implied it wasn't a good shoot.  Read my post...

I re-watched the video today after getting 8 hours of sleep and it wasn't as bad as I originally thought.  Still, there were some mistakes made.  

Someone who has no law enforcement training or experience would likely not notice anything wrong. 

The biggest impression I got from the video was that after being shot at less than 5' by what was likely .38 special FMJ, both criminals were still able to function, and get up and move around.  If they had actual real guns, they were both fully capable of returning fire.  If the clerk had had a pistol or shotgun stashed under the counter and one of the wounded perps had spotted it, then they could have grabbed it and used it against the security guard when he was jumping over the counter apparently with the intention of securing the fake guns.

Still, he stopped a robbery, and he controlled the situation.  He obviously read the subjects correctly when he chose to get so close to them, knowing they lacked the will to engage further.  Ordering the clerk to dial 911 and then order the dude in the blue to get on the ground was excellent.

Again, the title of the post was about the apparent lack of stopping power.

[Moshe]

Stopping power is about shot placement.  Perhaps he was trying to stop them, and not kill them?  Or, in the heat of the moment, for once a year qualification people, he did what a lot do, when pumped up with adrenaline trying to hit a moving target, especially a smaller framed person, and caught the arm instead of center mass?  Also, being a security guard, it is probably what he could afford, or what his company issued.  A .38 can kill if pumped through the heart, or put through the ocular window.

[AerynSun2]

14 hours ago, PNWguy said:

Jury?  What the hell are you talking about?  I never said or implied it wasn't a good shoot.  Read my post...

I re-watched the video today after getting 8 hours of sleep and it wasn't as bad as I originally thought.  Still, there were some mistakes made.  

Someone who has no law enforcement training or experience would likely not notice anything wrong. 

The biggest impression I got from the video was that after being shot at less than 5' by what was likely .38 special FMJ, both criminals were still able to function, and get up and move around.  If they had actual real guns, they were both fully capable of returning fire.  If the clerk had had a pistol or shotgun stashed under the counter and one of the wounded perps had spotted it, then they could have grabbed it and used it against the security guard when he was jumping over the counter apparently with the intention of securing the fake guns.

Still, he stopped a robbery, and he controlled the situation.  He obviously read the subjects correctly when he chose to get so close to them, knowing they lacked the will to engage further.  Ordering the clerk to dial 911 and then order the dude in the blue to get on the ground was excellent.

Again, the title of the post was about the apparent lack of stopping power.

What should be noticed is your misinterpretation on the facts.

1 person was shot in the arm - the 2nd we don't know where he was shot.

 

Life isn't a movie.  One gun shot in a non critical area doesn't put someone down.

[Suspect Unknown]

I think that they guy did pretty well, he wounded them, and took them out of the fight; and he was close enough to use follow up shots to the head, if he needed to.

Distance can be a friend or an enemy, and it all depends on what the guard was willing to do. 

 

Edited December 7, 2018 by Suspect Unknown

[crockett]

Saw this a while ago. While the security guard was pretty "cool" and Dirty Harry like, he was also lucky IMO. A semi hand gun, better ammo and a better stance would be nice. In the end he got the job done, so I'm fine with that.

 

That dialog is also some movie **** right there:

"Is fake, is fake!"

"Oh well! Mine is real!"

"Am I shot?"

"Oh **** yeah!"

Edited December 7, 2018 by crockett

[Moshe]

When did Security Guards and LEO's become the same thing?

[Fnfalman]

Like Shaft, he’s a bad mother$)(;&”?,.&

[usnret]

On 12/7/2018 at 8:48 AM, AerynSun2 said:

What should be noticed is your misinterpretation on the facts.

1 person was shot in the arm - the 2nd we don't know where he was shot.

 

Life isn't a movie.  One gun shot in a non critical area doesn't put someone down.

Correct for all calibers..I saw a video of a lady shot in the neck with a 44mag..she was talking, holding a towel to her neck..

I know this will drive Moshe nuts and 'maybe' not objective enough but still 'food for thought'.

 

[Moshe]

If I missed and grazed your neck with any of the calibers, your mortality rates drop dramatically, unless I hit the artery in the side of your neck, and then you are pretty much screwed.  If I hit you dead center in the neck, with a .44 magnum, you would be decapitated.

Edited December 11, 2018 by Moshe

[syntaxerrorsix]

Handguns are poor man stoppers without a CNS hit.  They just poke holes.  I don't care what caliber you use.  If you want more immediate incapacitation you need a rifle or shotgun.

[Wyzz Kydd]

‘Oh well, mine is real.’  Absolutely love it.

[DWARREN123]

It ended well which is what counts.

[jk_226]

On 12/10/2018 at 1:36 PM, Fnfalman said:

Like Shaft, he’s a bad mother$)(;&”?,.&

"Shut your mouth."

[Moshe]

I like 9mm for precision work.  I like .45 ACP, for wound channel, and it can be just as accurate.  I like .357 when they absolutely, positively have to die.  But, I feel the same about my LR 6.5 Creed.  But, that is rather impersonal, but leaves no DNA trace, or high impact blood splatter.  And sniping the scum of the earth does bring a certain sense of terror and might curtail their victimization of those weaker than them (children, women).  A good suppressor masks the report from that distance.  Program the right load in, and with the mods, the job is pretty much done for you.  A nice brass catcher, and you were never there.  That is my goal this year, NFA trust for my birthday, and squirreling away 200.00 a month.  Then it is decision time.  An Osprey for my .45, a complete suppressed upper for my Colt AR.  Or a solid suppressor on the 6.5 Creed.  Decisions, decisions.

[Moshe]

On ‎12‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 7:37 AM, usnret said:

Correct for all calibers..I saw a video of a lady shot in the neck with a 44mag..she was talking, holding a towel to her neck..

I know this will drive Moshe nuts and 'maybe' not objective enough but still 'food for thought'.

 

That would depend on a lot factors.  Shot placement is one of them.  I know and met with a Constable who got blasted by a shotgun at point blank by a crackhead.  He lost one of his balls, and a pellet was one centimeter from his femoral.  He showed me his multiple surgery scars that he bears for life.  He is still on leave.  Down in Atascasita.  He is back up in Livingston, living with his wife, mother, and child, and convalescing.  I ran into him in a mandatory fun event when the boss held it, and I was the plus one.  Like Reagan, he is not anti-gun, just anti-scum like I am.

[Moshe]

On ‎12‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 7:37 AM, usnret said:

Correct for all calibers..I saw a video of a lady shot in the neck with a 44mag..she was talking, holding a towel to her neck..

I know this will drive Moshe nuts and 'maybe' not objective enough but still 'food for thought'.

 

U.S. Navy Chief Petty Officer Chris Kyle. Navy SEAL Chris Kyle served four tours during the Iraq War, and during that time he became the most lethal sniper in U.S. military history with over 160 kills officially confirmed by the Department of Defense.May 8, 2017.  One shot, one kill.  Strange, all my white tail shots have had the same result in the past.

[hoppyjr]

Two words: shot placement.

[MikeG36]

38 Special sucks. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to be shot with it and it will kill..... eventually. Here's an interesting report from the early 1990s. I know technology has improved over the last 27+ years but it's still an eye opener.

https://guninstructor.net/Strasborg_Tests.pdf

 

 

Edited December 24, 2018 by MikeG36

[Silentpoet]

On 12/24/2018 at 2:52 PM, MikeG36 said:

38 Special sucks. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't want to be shot with it and it will kill..... eventually. Here's an interesting report from the early 1990s. I know technology has improved over the last 27+ years but it's still an eye opener.

https://guninstructor.net/Strasborg_Tests.pdf

 

 

Honestly the ammo the company was supposed to issue was **** when I was a security guard.  I qualified but never was assigned to any armed posts.  So for practical purposes the projectile technology might as well not have improved.

[Heisenberg]

On 12/6/2018 at 5:47 PM, PNWguy said:

The biggest impression I got from the video was that after being shot at less than 5' by what was likely .38 special FMJ, both criminals were still able to function, and get up and move around. 

Again, the title of the post was about the apparent lack of stopping power.

The term 'stopping power' is gibberish.

What is your factual basis for asserting '38 Special FMJ'?

Further, what round with 'stopping power' would have immobilized a subject after being struck once (anterior to posterior) in the upper arm or upper shoulder?