Police officer enters wrong apartment ,shoots tenant

[willie-pete]

1 hour ago, PATCHMAN said:

Jail and bail hearing before they sort it out?  

With all due respect, but you're too caught up with the fact she was LE when this happened and wasn't arrested fast enough for your liking.  

Was there an answer to my question in there? Would a civilian have been arrested the same night?

Edited September 8, 2018 by willie-pete

[F14Scott]

The facts are trickling down slowly but speculation is faster.
 
It appears that she used the elevator and got off on the wrong floor, the hallways of the floors seem to be looking alike. She tried to open the door of an apartment in the same location in the hallway like hers but of course, the key did not work.  It isn't really clear if she had entered the apartment since the  victim opened the door and a neighbour reported to have heard him yelling before the shots were fired. This is an incredible mess up and very obviously manslaughter and epic stupidity. The use of deadly force should be the last resort and this disaster could have been avoided and should have been avoided by a trained law enforcement professional, especially since DPD has a great trining program and three months of RBT and emphasizes on wrestling skills.
BLM protested yesterday and walked the streets with AK47s. 

While carrying, about a year ago, I did the same thing, getting off on the wrong floor, walking down the virtually identical hallway, and trying to insert my key into the lock of the apartment below me. My key wasn't working, and I was trying to figure out why, when the resident opened the door.

I didn't shoot him.

Sent from my phone using Tapatalk

[Collim1]

1 hour ago, willie-pete said:

In your experience/jurisdiction, would a civilian who entered a house/apartment, not their own and shoot/kill the legal occupant be allowed to go home for days while it was sorted out. Or would they have been taken immediately to jail that night, locked up and seen a judge the next morning for a bail hearing.

 

And if so, what jurisdiction is that?

If there is any legitimate claim to self defense/good faith and the person is an established member of the community that you don’t deem a flight risk, then yes. Absolutely. 

Gang/drug related, domestic violence, and homicide occurring during the commission of a felony then the answer is no. They would be charged immediately. 

In my jurisdiction it would go to grand jury. 

[Collim1]

14 minutes ago, F14Scott said:

While carrying, about a year ago, I did the same thing, getting off on the wrong floor, walking down the virtually identical hallway, and trying to insert my key into the lock of the apartment below me. My key wasn't working, and I was trying to figure out why, when the resident opened the door.

I didn't shoot him.

Sent from my phone using Tapatalk
 

I had a baby that didn’t sleep through the night until he was 15 months old. I did some stupid ass stuff during that time. I was a walking zombie. 

Lack of sleep can do some serious things to your judgement. I have seen first hand. 

Had she just came off of a 20 hour long crime scene, and hadn’t slept in 24+ hours I could that as a legitimate contributing factor. 

The fact is there are way too many variables with what’s known. She could have been having a mental health episode or drug interaction. We will have to wait for more information. 

Edited September 8, 2018 by Collim1

[Will Beararms]

5 hours ago, PATCHMAN said:

If it turns out this was motivated by (assuming) a personal relationship gone bad, how that that make her a dirty cop?    Personal relationships gone bad is a fairly common reason for people to kill.  If she had been a secretary, would she be called a dirty secretary who deserves harsh punishment?  IDK.  

Since she is LEO, the killing would make her a dirty LEO if criminal intent is provern. Otherwise, she is incompetent and not fit to serve. Would you want her to armed and on duty near you are your family? I would not. 

Edited September 8, 2018 by Will Beararms

[Will Beararms]

One thing is clear, this lady should never serve in an LEO capacity again. 

Reports are the victim was a fine young man—-highly respected while attending Harding University in Searcy, AR. 

[SevenSixtyTwo]

Reverse the parties involved and I wonder how the conversation would go. 

 

[willie-pete]

20 minutes ago, Will Beararms said:

One thing is clear, this lady should never serve in an LEO capacity again. 

Reports are the victim was a fine young man—-highly respected while attending Harding University in Searcy, AR. 

Haven't heard that name in a while. My last missile site was near Searcy; the Alternate Command Post @ 3-8.  Are you familiar with the area?

[PATCHMAN]

1 hour ago, Will Beararms said:

Since she is LEO, the killing would make her a dirty LEO if criminal intent is provern. Otherwise, she is incompetent and not fit to serve. Would you want her to armed and on duty near you are your family? I would not. 

If proven she had criminal intent to kill, she would be dirty to the same degree as anyone else with criminal intent who kills.   The same as a secretary who kills and you label the secretary a dirty secretary. Or a truck driver would be a dirty truck driver.  Or a stockbroker would be a dirty stockbroker, etc... 

 

 

[PATCHMAN]

1 hour ago, F14Scott said:

While carrying, about a year ago, I did the same thing, getting off on the wrong floor, walking down the virtually identical hallway, and trying to insert my key into the lock of the apartment below me. My key wasn't working, and I was trying to figure out why, when the resident opened the door.

I didn't shoot him.

Sent from my phone using Tapatalk
 

At least we have established that getting off the wrong floor and going to what you believed is "your" apartment can happen.  

And the resident didn't shoot you.  That's good.  When that door opened, where were you in the OODA loop?

This is what's so interest with "what if" scenarios.  What If that had been your apartment.  And the person coming out had been burglarizing your apartment.  And that person was armed.  Where would you have been in this case in the OODA loop?  And would you have been around the next day?  

[F14Scott]

At least we have established that getting off the wrong floor and going to what you believed is "your" apartment can happen.  
And the resident didn't shoot you.  That's good.  When that door opened, where were you in the OODA loop?
This is what's so interest with "what if" scenarios.  What If that had been your apartment.  And the person coming out had been burglarizing your apartment.  And that person was armed.  Where would you have been in this case in the OODA loop?  And would you have been around the next day?  

Why isn't my key working?
Why aren't my dogs squealing?
Could my wife have engaged the deadbolt?
Someone is opening the lock, but my wife isn't saying "sorry, sorry" like we do when we've locked each other out.
The guy who opened the door did it slowly and he was sleepy, standing there in his boxers.

I had it all figured out within about a second of seeing him. I grinned sheepishly and said, "Sorry, wrong floor."

If he had been a bad guy, he would have caught me very off guard. I was pretty much confused condition white.

Sent from my phone using Tapatalk

[ASH]

warrant issued , and i bet she still getting paid

https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/07/us/dallas-police-shooting/index.html

Quote

 

 

[SevenSixtyTwo]

Many years ago while working in Fort Myers Fl, I returned to my hotel room after work, unlocked the door and walked in to find a young lady propped up in the bed watching TV. She was frozen with someone of my appearance walking in on her. I was speechless for a bit. I asked if it was room #xx, she confirmed it was the room I thought I was in. She said she had just checked in a couple of hours earlier. I hadn't checked out as I was there for the week. She called the office to inquire. Screwup at the office. We agreed it was a dangerous situation for both of us. I apologized and left. Office issued me a key for a different room. No one got shot. If she had shot me, there would have been a legitimate fear on her part. I just stopped in my tracks. If I had shot her, how could I possibly justify it? There would be no justification.

 

[SevenSixtyTwo]

1 hour ago, PATCHMAN said:

At least we have established that getting off the wrong floor and going to what you believed is "your" apartment can happen.  

And the resident didn't shoot you.  That's good.  When that door opened, where were you in the OODA loop?

This is what's so interest with "what if" scenarios.  What If that had been your apartment.  And the person coming out had been burglarizing your apartment.  And that person was armed.  Where would you have been in this case in the OODA loop?  And would you have been around the next day?  

Rule #4. Know your target. Would you know for a fact that the occupant was a burglar and not the ol' scruffy maintenance man checking for leaks due to a downstairs resident complaining of water seeping through the ceiling? Just by the mere presence of someone in your apartment? This wasn't even her apartment. She went into someone else's apartment and shot the resident. There is no justification.

[PATCHMAN]

55 minutes ago, SevenSixtyTwo said:

Rule #4. Know your target. Would you know for a fact that the occupant was a burglar and not the ol' scruffy maintenance man checking for leaks due to a downstairs resident complaining of water seeping through the ceiling? Just by the mere presence of someone in your apartment? This wasn't even her apartment. She went into someone else's apartment and shot the resident. There is no justification.

She went to the apartment thinking it was her apartment. 

[PATCHMAN]

1 hour ago, SevenSixtyTwo said:

Many years ago while working in Fort Myers Fl, I returned to my hotel room after work, unlocked the door and walked in to find a young lady propped up in the bed watching TV. She was frozen with someone of my appearance walking in on her. I was speechless for a bit. I asked if it was room #xx, she confirmed it was the room I thought I was in. She said she had just checked in a couple of hours earlier. I hadn't checked out as I was there for the week. She called the office to inquire. Screwup at the office. We agreed it was a dangerous situation for both of us. I apologized and left. Office issued me a key for a different room. No one got shot. If she had shot me, there would have been a legitimate fear on her part. I just stopped in my tracks. If I had shot her, how could I possibly justify it? There would be no justification.

 

You had a gun on you?  Did you think to draw your gun or actually did draw your gun?  Where were you in the OODA loop?

 

With all due respect, but any failure to react because you were way behind in the OODA loop does not give you bragging rights today to say or imply how you were in control of a situation.     

[PATCHMAN]

2 hours ago, F14Scott said:

Why isn't my key working?
Why aren't my dogs squealing?
Could my wife have engaged the deadbolt?
Someone is opening the lock, but my wife isn't saying "sorry, sorry" like we do when we've locked each other out.
The guy who opened the door did it slowly and he was sleepy, standing there in his boxers.

I had it all figured out within about a second of seeing him. I grinned sheepishly and said, "Sorry, wrong floor."

If he had been a bad guy, he would have caught me very off guard. I was pretty much confused condition white.

Sent from my phone using Tapatalk
 

Thank you for your candor.  I'm glad you're here today.  

Edited September 8, 2018 by PATCHMAN

[Pistolay]

6 hours ago, PATCHMAN said:

The words "pure speculation" at the start of my post, and the words "pure speculation on my part" at the end of my post is what Perry Mason would call clues.

Actually no, clues are facts and speculation is a guess. Not nearly the same thing.

[Pistolay]

Duplicate post

Edited September 8, 2018 by Pistolay

[SevenSixtyTwo]

1 hour ago, PATCHMAN said:

You had a gun on you?  Did you think to draw your gun or actually did draw your gun?  Where were you in the OODA loop?

 

With all due respect, but any failure to react because you were way behind in the OODA loop does not give you bragging rights today to say or imply how you were in control of a situation.     

Yes. I started life with a snubby. No I did not draw. Didn't even cross my mind. No OODA loop. There was a young lady propped up on the bed watching TV.

Who's bragging? I wasn't in control of the situation. I surprised someone by walking in on her. Should I have shot her?

[SevenSixtyTwo]

1 hour ago, PATCHMAN said:

She went to the apartment thinking it was her apartment. 

That's what she says. Then she shot the guy that lived there.

[ASH]

i hope she dont have kids  , if you cant figure out where you live  you are more prone to leave kids in hot cars ,  sink running , phone uncharged , no dog food ,  picking up your socks ,  combing you hair, setting alarm , not washing the reds with the whites ,flushing ,  

[Will Beararms]

5 hours ago, PATCHMAN said:

If proven she had criminal intent to kill, she would be dirty to the same degree as anyone else with criminal intent who kills.   The same as a secretary who kills and you label the secretary a dirty secretary. Or a truck driver would be a dirty truck driver.  Or a stockbroker would be a dirty stockbroker, etc... 

 

 

Except a Police Officer is expected to enforce the law. 

[ASH]

im a dirty farmer   it takes 2 washes  sometimes  to get the dirt out of my britches  .

[Boogieman]

I hate to try and second guess a LEO.  But it seems that once she had the gun in her hand, unless he was armed or attacked, the perceived threat was over.