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Any functional improvements for the Gen 4 or 5 over the Gen 3?


Boogieman
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Did any of the internal changes on the Gen 4 or 5 improve the function/reliability/durability in any way?  I don't mean the finger grooves,  backstraps or ambi stuff.  Do they work any better?

No. Why do you ask such a specific question with all of these qualifications?

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1 hour ago, Boogieman said:

Did any of the internal changes on the Gen 4 or 5 improve the function/reliability/durability in any way?  I don't mean the finger grooves,  backstraps or ambi stuff.  Do they work any better?

IMHO, in the G17/5 the trigger is much better than the Gen3 or 4. Maybe it's just me. If you're a lefty, which I'm not, the added slide release might be considered a functioning improvement. Reliability wise - it's like all Glocks, it works.

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1 hour ago, t4terrific said:

No. Why do you ask such a specific question with all of these qualifications?

What qualification?  All I want to know is if any of the internal changes were an improvement.  Was there a problem with the internal workings of the Gen 3 that I wasn't aware of?

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I don't have much experience with Gen 4's but I prefer the simplicity of the older single- spring RSA. The newer dual spring assemblies were supposed to help with recoil, but what recoil? I have had Gen 2 and 3 G19's and G23's and a G20 SF and none of those guns have any recoil worth mentioning compared to 41 and 44 magnums I've owned or worse yet a 357 magnum chambered in a 15 ounce airweight J-fame Smith.

The Gen 5 supposedly has improvements such as to the firing pin safety and slide lock spring, trigger assembly, ejector, firing pin and other internal parts and some of these improvements are supposed to aid longevity but considering how many Gen 3 guns have had hundreds of thousands of round fired out of them in competition I wonder what there was that needed improving? Additionally, even if some of these improvements were a step forward, they also took a step backwards by eliminating the locking block support pin.

This is similar to what they did with eliminating the finger grooves which was a major step forward but then they took a major step BACKWARDS by adding the dumbass magazine cut-out.

As such, the only Gen 5 I'd be interested in would be the G19x which has neither the finger grooves not the mag cut-out but only if they offered it in the NORMAL Black color instead of Coyote Turd Yellow. I am a HUGE Glock aficionado but I'm not really a fan of the Gen 5's.

 

 

Edited by Borg warner
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17 minutes ago, Borg warner said:

rience with Gen 4's but I prefer the simplicity of the older single- spring RSA. The newer dual spring assemblies were supposed to help with recoil, but what recoil? I have had Gen 2 and 3 G19's and G23's and a G20 SF and none of those guns have any recoil worth mentioning compared to 41 and 44 magnums I've owned or worse yet a 357 magnum chambered in a 15 ounce airweight J-fame Smith.

The Gen 5 supposedly has improvements such as to the firing pin safety and slide lock spring, trigger assembly, ejector, firing pin and other internal parts and some of these improvements are supposed to aid longevity but considering how many Gen 3 guns have had hundreds of thousands of round fired out of them in competition I wonder what there was that needed improving? Additionally, even if some of these improvements were a step forward, they also took a step backwards by eliminating the locking block support pin.

This is similar to what they did with eliminating the finger grooves which was a major step forward but then they took a major step BACKWARDS by adding the dumbass magazine cut-out.

As such, the only Gen 5 I'd be interested in would be the G19x which has neither the finger grooves not the mag cut-out but only if they offered it in the NORMAL Black color instead of Coyote Turd Yellow. I am a HUGE Glock aficionado but I'm not really a fan of the Gen 5's.

You are entirely correct about the recoil, but to a brand new shooter, with say a G19 as a first handgun and NO experience shooting, recoil can seem like a lot just because they have never experienced it.

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25 minutes ago, Citra47 said:

You are entirely correct about the recoil, but to a brand new shooter, with say a G19 as a first handgun and NO experience shooting, recoil can seem like a lot just because they have never experienced it.

I understand the physics behind a dual spring system in a baby Glock.  But I don't get it in the larger guns.  Even in a G20 I couldn't feel the difference.

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The dual recoil spring supposedly adds to it's lifespan (needing fewer replacements) vs the original. A very small plus in my book. Also, IIRC, I read on TOS about changes made to the frame strength in the Gen 4s. That was only really relevant when dealing with the larger calibers, and then only at very high round counts. That may be total BS but was from (Mike_M) over there. I've never heard or read of many issues with any Gen 3 guns, regardless of caliber. If there is a difference, it's more likely theoretical rather than a common thing.

For MY use, I prefer the new, larger mag release. That, the more aggressive texture and the smaller grip circumference are the only changes that make the newer generation work better for me.

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13 minutes ago, minderasr said:

I'm aware of the "Fix" for the mag cut out and I've used the Pearce PG-FML baseplates in my Gen 2 Glocks for many years. But when Glock came out with the Gen 3's they took a giant step forward by eliminating the mag cut-out but simultaneously took a giant step backwards by adding  the finger grooves that fit only about half the population. 

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24 minutes ago, minderasr said:

From what I've read, quite the opposite.  Without the modified base plate, people complain the gap creates a hot spot on the pinky.

Seems that on a mag change there'd be no way to prevent a pinky pinch while still maintaining a full grip.

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I've owned gen 2-4 Glocks. They were all as reliable and durable as a mechanical device could be.  I don't understand why Glock decided to go back to the two pin frames. Had to be manufacturing cost, I guess.  I think that was a step in the wrong direction.  While there might have been subtle design changes that might be considered an improvement through the generations, I'm convinced most were marketing ploys. 

s45 

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12 hours ago, Smokey45 said:

I've owned gen 2-4 Glocks. They were all as reliable and durable as a mechanical device could be.  I don't understand why Glock decided to go back to the two pin frames. Had to be manufacturing cost, I guess.  I think that was a step in the wrong direction.  While there might have been subtle design changes that might be considered an improvement through the generations, I'm convinced most were marketing ploys. 

s45 

 

Fitting the ambi-slide release was the cause from what I have read. The government contract required that. I too, don't like it. I say that as a lefty. I have long ago adapted to the earlier versions. In my view, the Gen 5 is one step forward with two steps back. Thankfully, they are still making the Gen 3s and Gen 4s.

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On ‎8‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 6:11 PM, mmcbeat said:

The Gen 5 Glocks went back to a two pin frame. Not sure if this is an improvement, just throwing it out for discussion.

They did it to accommodate the ambi slide release which was a requirement for the government contract. In my opinion it was not very well thought out but they wer in a hurry to meet the requirments of the contract and figured the guns were only going to be in 9mm only and wouldn't need the extra support and so some have speculated that there won't be any Gen 5's in 40, 357 Sig, or 10mm.

But Glock made some gen 5 G22 40 caliber guns for Brazil that were 2 pin guns so it's hard to say what's up with that. I'd just as soon Glock made a Gen 6 that would have a different way of reinforcing the locking block and a slide release available in either Left only, Right only or Ambi. I'd also like to see then make the G19x configuration with NO finger grooves AND no dumbass mag cut-out AND with factory extended mags available in 40 and 357 Sig and in a CHOICE of either normal black, Coyote Turd Yellow, or maybe whatever other designer color that is the current rage.

Glock Gen 5 G22:

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2018/02/19/sao-paulo-military-police-glock-gen5-g22-initial-test-setback/

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30 minutes ago, Boogieman said:

Didn't Glock go to the three pin frame because the 40 was damaging two pin frames?

Yes. The recoil impulse at the locking block was causing the plastic to stretch and the locking block was rotating around that single forward pin resulting in the forward legs of the block to move up and hit the bottom of the barrel and slide, leading to jams.

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1 minute ago, Borg warner said:

Yes. The recoil impulse at the locking block was causing the plastic to stretch and the locking block was rotating around that single forward pin resulting in the forward legs of the block to move up and hit the bottom of the barrel and slide, leading to jams.

I'm going to borrow a friend's Gen 5 G17 and compare it to my Gen 1.  Curious to see what was done (hope was done) to strengthen the newer version.  Assuming the Gen 5 G17 and G22 frames are identical.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Recoil is a subjective thing.  I know a lot of people say that none of the semi-auto handguns have recoil worth noticing compared to their airweight magnum revolvers, and that's true.

From what I've seen online though, there are plenty of people that end up buying aftermarket springs of different weights for the gen 3 and before guns when chasing the ends of what it will handle.  My experience with my Gen 4 G20 with it's dual spring RSA is that I can fire anything from rather mild PPU ammo in .40 s&w all the way to Underwood max loads (back when they had some that were not to be used in Delta Elites) and it hasn't had a single issue with any of it throughout that entire range.  I've looked and I haven't seen many options for gen 4 aftermarket dual springs in weights other than stock (but I admit I haven't looked very hard).  I'll give you the fact that there are adapters to use the gen 3 springs in the gen 4 however.

 

 

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